Re: Simple sentences and how difficult they can be.

Wow...you are confusing me :)

I would probably use SE, but that gives the impression of "swimming
from one point to another point" instead of just "swimming where the
points don't matter."

On 12/4/06, Sylvia Sotomayor <terjemar@...> wrote:
> As many of you know, Kēlen is a language without verbs. And for the
> most part I can translate almost any English sentence into it without
> too much awkwardness. The one class of exceptions has been action
> verbs, like run, or swim. But today I think I finally figured that one
> out, too.
>
> I have four verb-like objects called relationals. LA expresses
> existence, PA expresses a whole-part relationship, SE expresses
> existence with a source and/or a goal, and NI expresses a change in
> state.
>
> So, LA is good for 'there is' or 'there was', PA is more or less
> 'have', and NI is more or less 'become'. SE is a little trickier, but
> I use it for saying, giving, and experiencing.
>
> My problem with basic intransitive action verbs like run or swim is
> that I am never sure how to turn them into nominals and then express
> the relationship they would have with other nominals. Since NI feels
> more action-y to me than the others, I keep trying to fit them into a
> NI clause and it never seems right. So, today it occurred to me while
> skimming through a linguistics book, that SE is essentially NI without
> a change in state to its object.
>
> ñamma jasāla
> 'He made a song'
>
> means that a song has been composed, has come into existence, a change
> in state.
>
> tamma jasāla
> 'He expressed a song'
>
> means that he sang it, but the song itself hasn't changed. (tamma is
> SE plus a past marker plus a 3p sg source)
>
> So, it occured to me that running and swimming could be nominalized to
> 'a session of running' and 'a session of swimming' and then SE would
> be the correct relational because there is no real change in state. NI
> would imply the invention of running or swimming. So,
>
> tamma jahārme
> 'She swam'.
>
> (I don't have a satisfactory word for 'run'. Yet.) And,
>
> āl samma jahārme
> 'She is swimming'
>
> Does this make sense?
>
> Thanks,
> -S
> --
> Sylvia Sotomayor
> terjemar@gmail.com
> www.terjemar.net
>

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