Bootstrapping a cooperative conlang - red

In a message dated 11/19/2007 12:01:50 AM Central Standard Time,
hmiller@IO.COM writes:


> Take a really simple word like "red". If you had a definition for
> "apple" -- no, some apples are yellow -- if you had a word for "cherry"
> and a word for "color", you could say "color of a cherry". But why a
> cherry and not a tomato? And although it might be possible to eventually
> define a cherry or a tomato without referring to its color, how do you
> know there isn't some other fruit of a different color that fits the
> definition? Red is such a fundamental sensation that you need an easy
> way to express it (if your language has words for colors at all).
>
AW gives the following (partial) explication for red:

X is red. =
when one sees things like X one can think of fire
when one sees things like X one can think of blood

Analogously,
X is yellow. =
when one sees things like X one can think of the sun

X is blue. =
at some times people can see the sun above them in the sky
when one sees things like X one can think of the sky at these times
one can see things like X at times when one cannot see other things

Alternatively, she gives this explication of "blue" in contrast to Polish
"niebieski":

X is blue. =
(a) at some times people can see the sun above them in the sky
      when one sees things like X one can think of the sky at these times
(b) in some places there is a lot of (very much) water
     when people are far from these places
     they can see this water
     when one sees things like X one can think of this

X is green. =
in some places many things grow out of the ground
when one sees things like X one can think of this

Notice that there is no mention of the word "color".  Naturally, the words
used above that are not primes have to be explicated too.

For example, 'sky', 'sun', and 'fire' are as follows:

sky
something very big
people can see it
people can think like this about his something
     it is a place
     it is above all other places
     it is far from people

sun
something
people can often see this something in the sky
when this something is in the sky
people can see other things because of this
when this something is in the sky
people often feel something because of this

There is fire in that place. =
(a) something is happening in that place
(b) people can see it
(c) if at a time [at night] people couldn't see anything else in this place,
they could see this
(d) if someone is near that place, this person can feel something [warm, hot]
because of this happening
(e) something is happening to some things in that place [e.g. wood, coals]
because this is happening
(f) after this, these things will not be the same [they will turn to ashes,
etc.]
(g) people can think about it like this:
(h)     this is something
(i)      if someone touches this something, this person will feel something
very bad

She adds that even this explication for 'fire' may not even be complete,
because it includes no references to the role of fire in human life, namely
cooking, warmth, light, as well as destructive unwanted fires.  She includes lines
for referencing these roles, but they wouldn't add much here.

stevo   </HTML>

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