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Slit fricative (Was:Re: Saying "Thank you.")

From:Rob Nierse <rnierse@...>
Date:Wednesday, August 29, 2001, 6:53
> Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2001 07:01:23 -0500 > From: "Thomas R. Wier" <artabanos@...> > Subject: Re: Saying "Thank you." > > John Cowan wrote: > >> Thomas R. Wier scripsit: >> >> > As he said, it does indeed arise from external borrowing. IIRC, the only >> > known cases of a fricative to stop shift occur in Papua New Guinea. It is >> > at any rate an extremely rare type of sound change. >> >> It has also happened on de obscure island of Brooklyn. Yiz got a problem >> wit dat? > > I've read claims that this results from a Dutch substratum there. This implies > (a) that that feature of Brooklyn's speech is very old, and (b) that the Dutch > were not more or less immediately swamped by anglophone settlers.
This reminds me of a question I have. I would like to know what y'all think of it. In Dutch we have trouble pronouncing [T] and [D]. My question is about [T]. Dutch speakers that can't pronounce it, pronounce either a [t] or [s]. Now for some time I try to make a Gothic Pidgin, spoken in the Black Sea area by speakers of Russian/Ukrainian, Turkish, Greek and other languages like Georgian, Bulgarian, Adyghe etc. Greek has [T] too, so they don't have a problem with the gothic [T]. But how about the other speakers? How would they pronounce [T]. As a [t] like on the obscure island of Brooklyn? Or as [s], like some Dutch speakers do? Rob


Thomas R. Wier <artabanos@...>
Frank George Valoczy <valoczy@...>