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rhotic miscellany, and a usage note

From:Roger Mills <rfmilly@...>
Date:Friday, November 5, 2004, 0:53
J. 'Mach' Wust wrote:
> > --- Ray Brown <ray.brown@...> skrev: > >> That was the /r/ used by Hitler, as you hear on > >> ancient newsreels. It may be - I don't know - that > >> this accounts for its demise in the last half > >> century. > > As I've said, I think the accent used in these ancient newsreels was just > the standard media accent of that time, for nazis as well as for > communists > or democrats. We just happen to hear more nazi newsreels than other ones > (which is sad if you think about it).
Hitler was Austrian IIRC and began his political rise in Bavaria. Is the trilled r possibly a southern feature?
OTOH Marlene Dietrich, almost his contemporary (and much nicer to listen to), had the uvular fric. r, often parodied by English speakers who hear it as closest to our [w]. OTTH, I'm now listening to my Lotte Lenya/Brecht/Weill CD, and she has a most amazing mixture of pronunciation: --a trilled alveolar [r] seems to predominate, especially in emphasized words, word final, in clusters like, gr...; perhaps this is "stage German". --almost an American /r/ in final position in unstressed words like der, einer, though it's possible it's uvular and doesn't come thru the recording process well. The first word of "Cäsars Tod"-- Rom -- sounds very American. If these songs were recorded in the 50s, it may be she'd acquired a bit of an American accent after 20+ years here. ======================== I really don't like to do this, but it seems to be in vogue to correct our foreign friends' usages. J. 'Mach' Wust wrote:
>but it is remarkable that somebody
can so totally acquire a foreign language that even native speakers of the same region are cheated!> "Cheated" is not quite right, and too strong in any case-- "fooled" (not malicious) or "deceived" (possibly malicious) would be more appropriate. "Cheat" connotes deceiving with illicit or dishonest means and motives-- cheat at cards, cheat on an exam, cheat in an election (did I say that???), cheat s.o. out of his money.


John Cowan <jcowan@...>