Re: Etruscana (was: some Proto-Quendic grammar)

>
On Monday, November 17, 2003, at 07:49 AM, Andreas Johansson wrote:

> Quoting Ray Brown <ray.brown@...>:
[snip]

> In 1925 Paul Kretschmer put forward a theory linking Etruscan to IE or, as
>> he called then, 'Indogermanisch'.  According to him, the IE were
>> descended
>> from 'Urindogermanisch' (i.e. what we now call PIE), which had a sister
>> language, 'Urrätotyrrhenisch' (Proto-Raet-Tyrrhenic) from which were
>> derived
>> Raetian,
>
> I tought it was spelt "Rhaetian"? But apart from that, how much is known
> about
> this language?
The Romans normally wrote _Raeti_, _Raeticus_ etc.  The occasional
spellings with rh-
are doubtless prompted by the conventional latinizing of Greek words - but
these ain't
Greek words.  Kretschmer used the spelling without the intrusive 'h', and
I see no
reason to do otherwise. Both spellings - Raetia & Rhaetia are found in
English.  But
for some reason the 'h' AFAIK is always included in the term
'Rh(a)eto-Romance.

As for their language, practically nothing is known for certain. It's only
from the
testimony of the Roman historians that we assume the Raeti and Etruscans
were related.
In an area between the Trento-South Tyrol region and pre-Alpine mountains
between Lake
Garda and Padua, some 70 inscriptions have been found.  These are
conventionally termed
R(h)(a)etian; but I understand they bear no obvious resemblance to
Etruscan, though
their alphabet is of Etruscan origin.  The inscriptions were published by
Conway-Whatmaugh
"The Prae-italic Dialects II (Cambridge, MA, 1933), inscriptions 188 to
254, and more
recently by V. Pisani (Editor) "Le lingue dell'Italia antica oltre latino"
  (2nd. ed. Turin 1964), pages 317 sqq.   Go, seek  :)

>> Etruscan, and Pelasgic (the pre-Greek language of Greece) inter
>> alia.
>> Both Urindogermanisch & Urrätotyrrhenisch were, he said, descended from
>> a
>> common
>> ancestor 'Protindogermanisch' - _not_ our PIE, but one generation back,
>> i.e. the Nostratic that some now theorize about.
>
> Distinguishing between "Urindogermanisch" and "Protindogermanisch" does
> strike
> me as unhelpful terminology ...
Blame Paul Kretschmer  :)

[snip]

> Someone ought to make the definite list of languages no-one has suggester
> are
> related to Basque ...
'twould not be very long!  Indeed, I suspect it would be an empty list.

Ray
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