Re: LUNATIC SURVEY: 2005

On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 13:41:04 -0500, Sally Caves <scaves@...> wrote:
>
> LUNATIC SURVEY 2005, by Sally Caves
>
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
> A. PROFESSION, DEMOGRAPHICS, INCLINATION:
>
> 1. Who are you, and what is the name of your invented language or languages?
> Pseudonyms allowed. (Are you using one? asked "Sally Caves")
I'm Philip Newton. I don't really have any languages to speak of,
though I've used one I called "Ko e Vagahau he Motu" in a relay
before, and there's at least one more in the back of my mind, but it's
no more than a vague idea at this point. I'm more of a passive
conlanger.

> *2. Are you new to the Lunatic Survey or have you filled out a version of
> this survey before?
First time.

> 3. Do you have a website for you language/world(s)? If so, please list the
> URL address.
Nope; nothing has been fleshed out yet. Even for Ko e Vagahau e Motu,
the relay page is, TTBOMK, the entire extant written down information
about that language.

> 4. What is your email address? name at hostsite dot whatever.
philip.newton@gmail.com is the address that's currently subscibed to
CONLANG-L. I've got lots of other addresses, and have subscribed to
the list with Philip.Newton@gmx.net in the past, I believe.

> 5. What is your age? (vague answers allowed, but it is an important
> demographic)
30.

> 6. What is your gender?
Male.

> 7. What is your nationality?  Where do you live now?
I'm British, but I was born and raised in Germany.

> 8. What is your native language?
English and German; chronologically in that order, by order of current
competence possibly in the reverse order. I started speaking German at
around three.

> 9. What natural languages foreign to you have you studied or do you speak?
Have had formal lessons in: French, Japanese, Greek. Have picked up
bits and pieces of: oodles. Foremost are probably Swedish, Dutch,
Spanish, and Chinese, not in any particular order. Competence ranges
from knowing a couple of words to being able to recognise and produce
simple sentences.

> 10. What is your level of education? i.e., your highest degree achieved or
> sought?
IB (International Baccalaureate). From anecdotal evidence, very
roughly equivalent to one year of US college.

> 11. What is your profession? Are you a professional linguist? If so, what
> also makes you a conlanger?
I'm a software developer. Conlanging, such as it is, is strictly a hobby.

When people learn that I'm fascinated by languages, though, they are
occasionally surprised that I did not pursue a job related to
languages.

> 13. If you are a student, what is your major or your area of study?
n/a

> 14. How long have you been developing your invented language(s)?
Not at all; they are nothing more than vague ideas of what I'd like to
put into a language, but I haven't gone ahead and actually written
down anything.

> 15. At what age did you first start inventing a language? Can you briefly
> describe your early efforts?
Can't remember.

> 16. What drew you to start inventing a language and/or constructed world?
> What was the inspiration?
Hm. I've been fascinated with languages for as long as I can remember,
but I can't recall when I started being interested in possibly
creating one myself.

The inspiration was probably the constructed languages I had come
across. Though one thing that was probably a strong influence was
coming across Mark Rosenfelder's pages, then still on tezcat.com,
probably through the sci.lang FAQ, but then also seeing his conlangs
and the Language Construction Kit.

> 17. Did you start inventing before you had heard of the list or after?
> Before you had heard of Esperanto or Tolkien? (I name the two most common
> inspirations)
n/a

> 18. Tolkien calls it a "shy art" and a "secret vice"; but that was before
> the Internet. How secret do you keep it from others outside this list for
> much the same reasons?
Well, I haven't done much of anything to speak of.

> 19. Yaguello has called it "pathological," influenced, unfortunately, by a
> lot of psychiatric writings such as _Le Schizo et la langue_. To what extent
> have you encountered such reactions by outsiders you had taken into your
> confidence?
n/a

> *20. Do you consider it nerdy to be doing this? This is a term that gets
> tossed around a lot. Or actually sophisticated? Do you need to get a life,
> or is this your life? What is a life?
Yes, I think it's a bit of a nerdy thing to do.

I don't think that people who are heavily into conlanging necessarily
need to get a life, though.

> 21. There has been a connection noted between linguistic and musical
> ability. Are you musically inclined? Do you sing and/or play a musical
> instrument? Do you compose music?
I occasionally enjoy singing bass in a choir. I had piano lessons. I
don't claim to be particularly gifted musically, though, and I don't
compose. (In general, I don't consider myself very creative.)

> 22. There has been a connection noted between linguistic and mathematical
> ability. Are you mathematically inclined or inclined towards computing in
> any way?
Definitely yes, on both counts: mathematically inclined and inclined
towards computing.

> 23. What other passions do you pursue that give you creative pleasure?
> (painting, drawing, sculpting, calligraphy, model-building, novel or
> story-writing, role-playing games, map-making, book-making, poetry,
> web-designing, star-gazing or other?)
None to speak of.

> B. FEATURES OF YOUR INVENTION
>
> 1. Pick the best term for the invented language you are currently invested
> in: auxlang, artlang, engelang, loglang, lostlang, philosophical language,
> or "other." etc.
artlang. Personal pet projects.

> 2. Is your conlang a priori (devised from scratch) or a posteriori (based on
> an existing natural language or drawing from a language class such as
> Semitic)?
A posteriori: Ko e Vagahau e Motu is based very closely on Niuean, a
Polynesian language, and my other embryo conlang will probably be
influenced by Greek.

> 4. Do you have a script for your conlang? What is it called? Could you
> provide me at a later date with a sample of it?  Is it on Langmaker's
> "neography" site?
KEVHM uses the Niuean orthography, that is, the Roman alphabet with
the addition of vowels with macrons. L2, for want of a better name
(and to save having to type "my embryo conlang which exists only as
vague notions"), I don't know what script it will end up with. I'm
considering taking Greek and applying Polish-like sound changes to it,
but whether that will be L2 or another language, I don't yet know;
this language would use the Latin alphabet plus certain extensions,
such as are used in Polish (e.g. vowels with ogonek, consonants with
accents).

> 5. Briefly describe the outlines of your invented language (syntactical
> structure--VO, OV, etc.; class or type--analytic, synthetic, agglutinating,
> incorporative, accusative, ergative, active, trigger, other, combinations,
> etc.), noting what you have done with it that is innovative in your opinion.
KEVHM is arguably ergative. It's verb-first. Analytic, I'd say. L2
would probably be synthetic and accusative.

> 7. How extensive would you say your invented language is, now? How big the
> vocabulary? Do you provide a vocabulary list or taxonomy on your website if
> you have one?
KEVHM has no vocabulary of its own besides a couple of words I pulled
out of a hat for the relay. L2 has even less.

> 3. Does a constructed world accompany your invention(s)? What is it called?
No, no conworld.

> *9. Has your language and conworld ever served in a role-playing game or a
> world shared by other conlangers?
No.

> *15. If you use Roman script, how recognizably "phonetic" is your writing
> system? In other words, do you use unconventional letters or letter
> combinations to represent sounds? Why or why not? I'm thinking, of course,
> of Etabnannery, for those who remember it.
KEVHM is pretty phonetic. L2 would probably also be.

> *18. What on-line games do you play? (or devise?) Translations, Babel-text,
> Relays, etc.
I've participated in several relays - only once with a language that
was "mine" in any sense of the word, though.

> 20. Do you start and stop several different conlangs, or do you tend to
> stick with one and develop it over years?
I haven't even started one properly :)

> 21. What do you think makes a "complete" conlang, if a conlang can attain
> completion? What are your goals for completion? When do you grow "tired" of
> your conlang, or don't you?
Complete? Being able to express a wide range of meanings, I suppose. I
don't know how that could be measured, though. I don't have a goal for
completion.

> C. PHILOSOPHY AND AESTHETIC:
>
> 5. How natural do you wish to make it, or is that a concern? Or rather, how
> unnatural do you wish to make it?
Not a concern per se. They'll be fairly natural mostly because I'm not
creative enough to come up with anything of my own, so they'll be
fairly closely based on natlangs.

> *13. Do you ever rely on a software program to build vocabulary? Do those
> who don't think that's cheating? :)
I could imagine using software to create L2 by sound changes from Greek.

Those who start from scratch and use software aren't cheating, though.
Using random methods to generate vocabulary is fine by me.

> *14. Is conlang a hobby, a craft, or an art in your mind? This has been
> hotly debated, so the question is not as weird as it seems. Can conlanging
> be considered an art? Why or why not?
For me, it's a hobby. It can be an art for some people, I suppose - a
medium of expression.

> *15. If it is, who do you think are its consumers?
Generally, only the author himself :)

> *17. There has been some exciting talk recently (and over the years) about
> what a conlang is or is not. If you could pick a metaphor or write a
> descriptive phrase defining "conlang," what would that be?
A language that a person or group of people codifies that did not
exist before that codification.

> *18. Why or why not would you eschew the metaphors "miniature" or "model"?
"Miniature" implies to me a non-complete language, which I consider to
be a step in the process of becoming a "full" language, so I don't
consider it applicable to conlangs in general unless there is no
desire for further development of that language. "Model" can apply to
some conlangs.

> *21  What do you think distinguishes a conlang from a natural language, if
> you think so at all?  What would it take for a linguist to be fooled into
> thinking a conlang was a natural language?
There's nothing in conlangs _per se_ that distinguishes them from
natlangs, though there are conlangs that are probably implausible
natlangs (e.g. by violating "universals"). But it's possible to create
conlangs that could be natlangs IMO. Don't know how to recognise them,
though.

> D. THE LISTSERV
>
> 1. How did you first hear of this list?
Can't remember.

> 2. How long have you been on this listserv or on other related listservs?
> Continuously? Infrequently? Off and on? More off than on and vice versa?
I've been on for quite a while, but there was a longish pause in the
middle when I was unsubscribed as I couldn't cope with the volume.
I've been back on for quite a while again now.

> *3. What is the appeal of being on a listserv and contributing to it? Do you
> think you contribute moderately or excessively, or not enough? Do you tend
> to lurk ?
I tend to lurk. The main appeal of this list to me is learning about
linguistics in general rather than about specific conlangs.

> *5. How helpful has the list been in developing your language? In learning
> linguistic information?
For the latter, it's been extremely useful.

> *7. Do you peruse the websites of other conlangers?
Yes, some.

> 9. Have you ever set out to learn at least a little bit of someone's
> conlang, if only a word or two, or a phrase?
I'd learned more of other people's conlangs than I have in my own :)
For a while, I had some basic grasp of the grammar and vocabulary of
Mark Rosenfelder's Verdurian, for example, and I've used that language
in a couple of relays. I've also been interested enough in Lojban and
Klingon to learn a bit, and I've had looks at Ebisédian, though not
enough to memorise anything.

> *10. Do you peruse Jeffrey Henning's Langmaker.com site?
Very occasionally.

> 13. Do you know of anyone who does this kind of thing but who has never
> heard of the list?
I used to be on the ZBB (Zompist Bulletin Board); I don't know how
many of the conlang enthusiasts over there know of this list.

> *14. What other lists do you frequent related to conlanging?
ZBB, at one point. That's about it; I'm subscribed to a number of
conlang-related Yahoo!Groups but have, so far, only lurked.

> *22. What would Tolkien have done with such a community? He writes in "A
> Secret Vice" that language inventors "hardly ever show their works to one
> another, so none of them know who are the geniuses at the game, or who are
> the splendid 'primitives'." He suggests that perhaps in a later time
> language invention will become respectable, and such things can be
> exhibited. Have we reached that time?
Hm, difficult. I think not really. People in general are probably not
that open to invented languages, thinking them fanciful and
time-wasting things for artlangs, or, for auxlangs, multiple competing
possibilities none of which are, at first glance, obviously better
than de facto auxlangs such as English.

> *23. Is there a danger that over-exposure can make conlanging "banal"? To
> what extent is it exciting because it is a) considered disreputable, "corny"
> or "mad," or b) largely unknown to the world? Does it have a fizzle-out
> date?  In other words, is it just a fad, or is it a natural human
> inclination that will stand the test of time?
I think a lot of conlangers conlang because they enjoy languages,
regardless of how popular or unpopular that pastime is.

> Finally, may I have your permission to use any of this material of yours for
> my academic work on conlanging? First name? last name? pseudonym? anonymous?
If you can use any of this, you have my permission to do so. You can
attach my name to it, if you want.

Cheers,
--
Philip Newton <philip.newton@...>
Watch the Reply-To!