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Re: Fave conlangs and essentialist explanations

From:Irina Rempt <irina@...>
Date:Friday, April 5, 2002, 7:26
On Thursday 04 April 2002 23:34, Joe wrote:

> > [GR\] (IPA ram's horns (not quite greek l-c gamma) and s-c R) is a > > sequence of voiced velar fricative and (voiced) uvular trill. And > > IIRC, that is in fact what some variants of Dutch have in groen --- > > but I think the standard description says [Grun], with an alveolar > > trill instead. > > Hmmm...the book I read said that both were acceptable.
In the nineteen-sixties, the fashion said that the alveolar trill was the only acceptable /r/ and the uvular trill was sub-standard. I had two years of (unsuccessful) speech therapy in elementary school to get rid of my natural [R]. About sixty per cent of Dutch speakers have a natural [R]. These days, indeed, both are acceptable, though the current fashion is more like a soft velar glide, almost [j] but more to the back. Irina -- irina@valdyas.org Back up, but not perfect yet: www.valdyas.org/irina ---------------------------------------------------------------------- | Experience is what you get when you were expecting something else. | ----------------------------------------------------------------------

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Jan van Steenbergen <ijzeren_jan@...>Dutch R