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Re: word poll #2: articles

From:Andreas Johansson <and_yo@...>
Date:Saturday, May 11, 2002, 20:44
>From: Garrett Jones <alkaline@...> > >so, how do you translate the following meanings into your conlangs? I can >see several constructions possible: > >1. articles like in english >2. possessives >3. sentential word order >4. syntactic constructions >5. not overtly expressed (it's the default) >6. distinction not made > >note: i didn't use meanings of 'the' or 'a' that i found weren't an >"article" usage. I provided a lot of examples because some of these are >pretty subtle. > >T* = the, A* = a/an, N* = [none] > >THE: > >TA. a certain one being spoken of/already mentioned (introduced by AA). >-The story ended. >-So then I smacked the guy.
Tairezazh has a definite article _ez_ (unchanged un all numbers and cases, but with phonologically conditioned allomorphs _es_ and _e'_, the apostrophe signifying a "lost" sound like in English). Eg: _E' zgaik zglashk_ "The story ended"
> >TB. hypothetical instance of (introduced by AB). >-I want a girlfriend. The girl has to be cute. >-I need some paint. The paint is going to be used here.
There's no indefinite article. Your first example would translate as something like _Ta zrón kanzianas. Es stelza ai tsin dair._ (_kanziana_ is actually rather "female lover" - the Tairezans don't really have the concept of a girl-/boyfriend in our sense).
> >TC. the one and only (geographic/environmental/locational) >-The sun is very hot today. (both occurances here) >-The sky is bright today.
We-ell, from the Tairezan POV, the is no one and only sun, nor a one and only sky. Sure, we could speak of _e' zau_ "the sun", but that'd be speaking of THIS particular sun as opposed to THOSE other suns.
>-The world is falling apart.
Haven't decided what "the Universe" is in Tairezazh, but I figure it's gonna be a proper name.
>-I don't like the weather.
As English
>-He came to us from the north.
_Seno skenk sous tan zreth dasht_ with no article. (_Dasht_ actually means the direction from Earth to the Galactic centre, but whatever.)
>-I walked to the edge and contemplated jumping. (the edge of a cliff) >-Let's meet at the entrance. >-Where is the bathroom?
As English in all three cases
>TD. the one identified by/as (the modifier of the noun) >-the man who answered (as opposed to the one who ignored his phone) >-the hit of the week (as opposed to the hit of the year) >-the right to strike (as opposed to the right to remain silent) >-You can be the father in our play. >-The purple people eater is here to get us! >-What is the point of your story? >-The coffee in my cup is hot. >-Which one was the movie that you hate? >-We take the air we breathe for granted. >
As English.
>TE. an integral part or clothing of the obvious entity (possessives can >also >be used for these in english) >-I smacked him in the face. >-Take me by the hand. >-You should hold your mug by the handle. >-The surface is extremely hot, don't touch it. >-I held him by the collar. >
As English, except I'm not postive what "Take me by the hand" means.
>TF. that which is present/close, as opposed to remote >-The day has just started (as opposed to the next day) >-Where has the year gone?
As English.
> >TG. the one designated/named. related to NC. >-the President (of the u.s.)
Well, on it's own, you'll see f'rinstance _ez elko_ "the emperor", but "the X of Y" is generally converted into "Y's X"; _Kesheai elko_ "the emperor of Keshea".
>-the Mississippi (river)
Would be a proper name that takes no article.
>-the United States
Lower-case "the united states" would be as English - if used as a proper name the article would drop.
> >TH. the one considered the best, most fashionable (usually emphasized) >-That is *the* restaurant in town.
Haven't decided on this kind of thing yet.
> >TI. specified period of time >-the dark ages >-the seventies
As English
> >TJ. taken as a representative of the entire genus or type >-I'm learning how to use the typewriter. >-The cow is a domestic animal.
Probably the equivalents of "I learn to use typwriter" and "Cows are domestic animals"
> >TK. for an adjective used as a noun >-the good, the beautiful, the true
Same as English, if you mean "the good (one)" etc. Otherwise I dunno.
> >A/AN,SOME: > >AA. a certain one speaker has in mind. >-I saw a burning house on the way to the store. >-He has a nice car/some nice cars. >-I'm going to marry a Swede. (in response to: what is the nationality of >your fiancee?) >
No indefinte article. Probably "His car is/cars are nice" for the second.
>AB. any one of them in existence >-I need a girlfriend.
_Ta graif kanzianas_ with no article (an same comment re _kanziana_ as above).
>-I'm going to marry a Swede. (in response to: In twenty years, what type of >person will you marry?)
No article.
>-I need some paint. >
"I need paint"
>AC. in copulas, equality >-I am a doctor. >-That is a harmless snake. >-As a young girl she slacked off in school.
No article.
> >[NONE]: > >NA: a discrete amount of (for a non-count noun). (the word "some" can >always >be used before the noun). >-I need water. >-We need rocks for this project.
As English
> >NB: generalizations, applying to all the members of a type of >object/concept. >-Gold is very valuable. >-Guns are dangerous. >-I really don't like stupid dogs. >-He lacks intelligence. >-Anger is a destructive emotion.
As English
>-We really hate school.
Probably with article - we're hating the particular school we're forced to go to. If we're hating school in general, we're gonna say the equivalent of "We really hate schools", most likely.
> >NC: proper nouns. related to TG. >-Let's run away to Mexico. >-Where is Main Street? >-I don't speak Greek.
As English We'll, that's alot of "As English"s! Uncreative guy I am ... Andreas PS A nice Tairezazh word I happened to need the other day; _zhreishkerganeielener_. It's the dative plural of _zhreishkerganeiel_ "democratizer". Andreas _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: