Re: Hobbits spoke Indonesian!
| From: | Wesley Parish <wes.parish@...> |
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| Date: | Saturday, October 30, 2004, 8:49 |
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I can agree with that. But the key detail in most animals with a complex
social structure seems to be the body-brain ratio, and they've got the
erectus brain with its concomitant post-chimp social and technical
developments, with a chimpanzee-size body.
Ergo, their language had the potential to be quite complex - the key detail in
homo sapiens' complex society and complexifying technology, appears to be the
breakdown of the barriers between the different sorts of problem solving, and
the development of symbols.
Wesley Parish
On Sat, 30 Oct 2004 00:40, Chris Bates wrote:
> I didn't say they would have no language, or only language at the same
> level as chimps... I'm just not convinced that they would speak a language
> as complex as ours. :) I was thinking somewhere between the two extremes.
> But we'll probably never know unless they happen to have been advanced
> enough to leave written records for us, and we're clever enough to decipher
> them, which is doubtful since even if such records existed you usually need
> some knowledge of a related language to decipher a writing system like
> that. I know they needed such knowledge to figure out the Egyptian
> hieroglyphs.
>
> > From: Wesley Parish <wes.parish@...>
> > Date: 2004/10/29 Fri AM 08:38:44 GMT
> > To: CONLANG@LISTSERV.BROWN.EDU
> > Subject: Re: Hobbits spoke Indonesian!
> >
> > On Fri, 29 Oct 2004 05:14, Chris Bates wrote:
> > > Rodlox wrote:
> > > > according to recent archeological discoveries, it is now known that
> > > > Hobbits existed in Indonesia...so, which language do you think they'd
> > > > have known? :)
> > >
> > > The common tongue of course! No... they did find some simple tools with
> > > them and are suggested that despite their brain size (grapefruit sized
> > > apparently) they did use tools. But language is another matter, and I'm
> > > not sure language on our level is possible with a brain the size of a
> > > monkey's.
> >
> > This is inaccurate. The brain size is approx. 380 cc, chimp-sized.
> > However, it is the brain of a homo erectus derivation. Which implies it
> > has had several hundred thousand years worth of homo erectus tool use and
> > the subsequent brain development. Not forgetting, the need to manage
> > vastly more complex social structures than would have been common to
> > australopithecines.
> >
> > And they were three feet high, give or take a few inches. At slighly
> > less than six feet we have a brain about 1300 cc. I would estimate that
> > with a brain about a third of our size, and a body about half, they had
> > enough spare capacity to manage language more complex than the
> > chimpanzees have been shown capable of mastering - consider that a chimp
> > needs that 380+ cc to manage society, and life jumping through trees, and
> > so forth, and the Hobbits no longer had to consider jumping through trees
> > ... that would've freed up about 60 cc, at least, for language use.
> >
> > > Some language perhaps, but I wouldn't expect anything as
> > > complex as a natural language that's spoken by homo sapiens if I
> > > travelled back in time. :)
> >
> > --
> > Wesley Parish
> > * * *
> > Clinersterton beademung - in all of love. RIP James Blish
> > * * *
> > Mau e ki, "He aha te mea nui?"
> > You ask, "What is the most important thing?"
> > Maku e ki, "He tangata, he tangata, he tangata."
> > I reply, "It is people, it is people, it is people."
>
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