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Re: tolkien?

From:Steg Belsky <draqonfayir@...>
Date:Wednesday, December 17, 2003, 16:00
On Sunday, December 14, 2003, at 08:36  PM, Andreas Johansson wrote:
> Quoting Steg Belsky <draqonfayir@...>: >> Naaaa, if i were really that skillzed and/or audacious i would've come >> up with a lot more than just some sound correspondences and a >> word-analysis or two, i'd've filled in the whole Drughu language! >> Since I am writing this email while offline and therefore can't check >> for everything i've posted to the Conlang list about the >> Drughu-Rokbeigalm connection, here's what i remember: >> The Drughu word "gorgûn" used by Ghân-buri-Ghân is analyzable as: >> gorgu+u+n >> |gorgu| [gorgu] meaning "orc" (the Rok. cognate meaning something like >> 'swarm' if i remember correctly could be |gaurg| [gO4g], |gaurguh| >> (with final [V]) or |gaurgoo| (with final high central rounded vowel) >> depending on whether the final vowel was originally */@/, */@:/, or >> */u/) > > Have you done anything with Tolkien's statement that _gorgûn_ seems to > be > related to the Elvish words for "orc"? I've got my books back in > Sweden, so I > can't give you the reference, but I think it's in the essay "Quendi > and Eldar" in The War of the Jewels.
Not really... although it's very conceivable that the proto-form from which the word |gorgu| comes could have been borrowed or adapted from an Elvish language at or soon after the Awakening at Hildorien. Or, as a native word, the original meaning of the root may have been something like "swarm, swarming creature, creepy-crawly", which was preserved in the Rokbeigalmki form, but which was used for Orcs by the Drughu as originally an insult (or a sound-'translation' of an Elvish form?) which then replaced the original meaning of the word. I don't know much yet about Drughki, but assuming that it keeps some vestiges of the hypothetical Proto-R/D classificatory gender system we discussed here a few weeks ago, the word for 'orc' is not treated as belonging to the sentient gender. Comparatively, in Rokbeigalmki the word for 'orc' (borrowed from some form of Elvish), |urkud|, has the vestigial sentient-marker ending |d|, the same as |mald| 'human' and |kfend| 'elf'. -Stephen (Steg) "...i took the cane from a blind man and i tasted the fruit in the garden of eden; when i walk out of here i know i'll stand clear, but the taste in my mouth still remains, still remains..." ~ 'eden' by guster