Re: Question about transitivity/intransitivity

Douglas Koller wrote:

> >Christophe Grandsire scripsit:
> >
> >>  Note that English and French are quite liberal in that respect. But
there
> >>  are other languages for which transitive verbs *must* be used with an
> >>  object, even when you don't want to specify it. In other words, in
those
> >  > languages a sentence like *"I eat" is ungrammatical.
>
> I'm not disputing your point, and I haven't done a statistical survey
> (leave that to the grad students), but I think English may be a tad
> more liberal than the French in this regard. Many prominal verbs are
> such because they require an object. "I'm shaving" is okay English,
> but "*je rase" in French is as jarring as saying "I'm wearing" in
> English, hence "je me rase"; "I'm hurrying" vs. "je _me_ dépêche",
> usw.
>
I've been wondering how Basque would handle this (assuming it does), since
the aux.used with transitive verbs automatically includes reference to the
object.

"I-erg. apple-abs. eat("participle") AUX[1-agent, 3-obj., tense, indic.]" =
"I ate an apple"

Assuming you could not specify an object, you'd still be left with a
structure meaning "I ate it".  There is no passive, nor antipassive IIRC.

It's interesting (significant?) that in Engl/French etc. when "eat" et sim.
are used without an object, the implied object seems to be only a subset of
the possible objects---
"I ate/ have eaten/ am eating." (a meal or food in genl., not "an apple, a
steak, the whole pie")
'I killed a fly/the dog/my wife/50 of the enemy' vs the previously mentioned
confessional "I killed" (only 'someone' or 'people')-- perhaps a difference
in focus, object vs. action.

Indonesian gets around the French "middle voice" reflexive problem by having
the basic verb refer to the action performed on/by oneself, versus a derived
(caus.) form for the transitive, and I doubt the object could be omitted in
that case.

Saya mandi "I'm bathing [myself] ~ taking a bath"
Saya (me)mandikan anak "I'm bathing the child" (??*saya mandikan, and
definitely not *saya mandi anak.)

Likewise in Kash.