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(OT) Breton

From:Elliott Lash <al260@...>
Date:Wednesday, January 9, 2002, 19:59
, Stephen Mulraney <ataltanie@...> writes:

> On Tue, 8 Jan 2002 20:26:29 EST > Elliott Lash <AL260@...> wrote (> > >): > > Stephen Mulraney <ataltanie@...> (> >): > > > Elliot Lash <AL260@...> wrote (>): >
> > > Yes, well known to me. Pronounced /ISe/ at least in my book. > > I think this verifies that 'sea' is just a contraction of 'is ea', especially > because I feel uncomfortable about writing 'sea' and uncomfortable about saying > 'is ea'. In practice I'd use one in speech and the other one in writing, pronouncing > 'is ea' as 'sea', i.e. /Sa/ [you could be right about the vowel being /e/, but > I haven't really got the hand of SAMPA yet - the vowel I want is a little back > from the a of 'hat', but not very near the a of 'father']. O, there's a little > glide between the /S/ and the vowel, at least in my idiolect [which is not to > be trusted really, since it's the result of learning (badly) as a child from > multiple teachers with multiple dialects, forgetting it for 8 years and then > learning more systematically.... ;)] >
Ok, so maybe we should go with /IS'&/ or /S'&] for abbreviation. The /&/ is the sound in (for my dialect)the word /k&t/ <cat>
> > > If I have a point it might be that since in Irish the word for yes (typically > > > you'd just repeat the verb with or without negation, to answer a question) > > > probably comes from the copula, might it be the same in Breton? > > > I know that Irish & Breton aren't really so closely related, despite being > > > both Celtic, but I'd still be suprised if the Brythonic/p-branch side of > > > the family didn't have a copula. Anyway how would you say 'it is' in Breton? > > > Anything like 'ya' or 'sea' > > > > eo /e/ or /ew/. > [snip] > > Though I doubt they're cognate to the copula, since they are not used where > copular repitition conveys affirmation. And also, the Welsh copula is /iw/, from /@diw/. > > Ah, that's what I was rummaging for ;). So if you're right the Brythonic langs actually > have a non-verbal non-copula word for yes... though I think my Irish copula-derived 'yes' > (sea) is attaining this status, in that it might be alright to use it in response to > a verb-question too.
Well, recent discussions on this topic on this list indicate what I already knew and what I kind of withheld. Welsh /iE/ and Breton /ja/ are only used in a very restricted set of constructions. Usually however, it is like you say that Brythonic languages repeat the copula in Affirmation sentences.
> > > Now that I'm back in my University, I think I'll go to the library and check this out. > > Tell me what you find! > > > But..surely 'yes' is a basic vocabulary member? > > Yes, sorry, I didn't phrase it very well. I meant you shd look for cognates in, especially > nouns, verbs, and adjectives rather than (slightly) more 'functional' words like 'yes' - > since languages' development is more likely to preserve 'meanings' than 'structures' - > in the sense that it would be a loss for a lang to drop the word for 'fire' while > no-one (but linguists) would really miss e.g. the loss of one way of answering in the > affirmative in favour of another. Warning: this argument is unstable and likely to > topple at the slightest investigation.
haha, and investigate I shall.. as I have no way of knowing how to respond at the moment.