Re: L3 Numbers

The "i" is certainly nasalized (as you say, you can't say the "i" followed
by "n" without some nasalization) but there is also a soupcon of an "n"
there as well. I do not intend for the "n" to vanish.

I guess the best way for me to represent it is using the following words:

sing-queen

In your example of "sinker" the "i" feels like it should be [i] and not [I]
at least by the way I say it. But I'm not an expert at all and am only
trying to get my head around all of this.

As far as "-inta", there is no nasaliztion of the "i". It would be analagous
to "queen" the second part of your question would be correct.

Therefore, I'm supposing that my transcription should be

[tsi~nkwinta] and [tsi~nkwi]

Scotto

(P.S. I loved the cehaimt!)

-----Original Message-----
From: Constructed Languages List [mailto:CONLANG@listserv.brown.edu] On
Behalf Of ROGER MILLS
Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 10:58 PM
To: CONLANG@listserv.brown.edu
Subject: Re: L3 Numbers

Scotto Hlad wrote:
>
>Since you mentioned cinquinta I have a question about writing nasalized
>vowels in XSAMPA.
>
>If one says cinquinta, the first n goes nasal automatically due to the
>/k/ that follows it. Do I render it therefore as [tsi~kwinta] or
[tsinkwinta]?
>The same applies to cinqui: [tsinkwi] or [tsi~kwi]?
I have to say: it depends :-)))) The vowel preceding a nasal is often
nasalized to some degree; perhaps esp. if the nasal is [N]-- the lowering
velum allows a bit more air to exit thru the nose than a [n] or [m]. This
would be "sub-phonemic" and would only be indicated in a fairly close
phonetic rendering-- like "sinker" ['sI~Nk@r]. The nasal doesn't totally
vanish-- as it does in French and IIRC Portuguese.

Minor question-- is the written "n" in your cinqui, cinquinta ever
pronounced as [N] (as might be expected) or does it stay [n] (odd but not
impossible). (But if it totally vanishes, leaving behind only the nasalized
V, the spelling is sort of irrelevant.)  If you do intend for it to totally
vanish, then the correct phonetic renderings would be [tsi~kwi] and
[tsi~kwinta]. Then the written "n" is there only to mark nasalization, not
pronunciation (like French I think).

That brings up another question-- is the i in -inta also nasalized? or does
it only happen before nasal+[k, kw]? (probably nasal+g too, if you have
that)????

Once long ago, just for fun and games, I created a mini Romconlang, with
really weird spelling and pronunciation (my revenge on French).  If there
was a nasal anywhere in the word, everything was nasalized. If there was an
h, everything following it was dropped :-)) So 100 was cehaimt, pronounced
[sE~]