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Re: Colonels (was: Old Norse)

From:Roger Mills <romilly@...>
Date:Tuesday, June 27, 2000, 3:02
John Cowan wrote
>Also true in Brazilian Portuguese, to the extent that "o senhor" and "a
>are taught to students long before any second person pronouns.>
Similarly in Indonesian. In Wolff's beginning text, (publ.late 60s) we learned to use _saudara_ (Sanskrit) 'brother'-- but hardly anyone in Indonesia used it; in fact, they said it made them uncomfortable. I wonder if it wasn't a holdover from the early idealistic/Sukarno days, and perhaps felt like "comrade" must now feel to E. Europeans...? Most common polite addresses: to a male, Bapak (father), or Pak optionally with last name, or only name in the case of many Javanese; to a female, Ibu (mother) or bu plus name. Any official title could also be used, often preceded by Pak (Pak Jendral e.g.). Young people were also starting (in the 70s) to use _yu_, surely adopted from English lessons, but curiously, it has a perfectly good Austronesian history too, though not in Malay/Javanese. Then there's _anda_, superpolite 2nd person, used only in advertisements and public announcements-- on the train, for ex., we were summoned to the diner with "We invite you to proceed to the restaurant car, where we hope you will enjoy your delicious evening meal" (in BI, of course, utterly perfect grammar, and all _anda's_). It has a really meally-mouthed and pretentions feel to it, and you could see everyone giggling and cringing as they listened.