Re: Optimum number of symbols

Quoting "Mike S." <mcslason@...>:

> On Tue, 21 May 2002 21:08:46 -0500, Thomas R. Wier <trwier@...>
> wrote:
> >Quoting "Mike S." <mcslason@...>:
> >
> >> > [snip]
> >> > >structures, I think the simplicity and efficiency of the phonemic
> >> > >system easily trumps all contenders.
> >> >
> >> > English???
> >>
> >> I believe you are knocking down a strawman here.  No one would
> >> suggest that English orthography is the ideal model of a phonemic
> >> system.  It might be questioned whether it is a phonemic system
> >> at all.  I would argue that it a combination of phonemic and
> >> morphemic approaches.  [...]  Whatever the benefits or
> >> shortcomings of this combinational approach, they have little
> >> or no bearing as criticisms of a true phonemic system.
[...]

> Interestingly (assuming my German doesn't fail me the way it
> failed me the other day), the words you picked are *almost* an
> example of both cases at once:  <Rad> and <Rat> sound alike, but
> are spelt differently; <das Rad> und <die Raeder> contain stems
> that are spelt *almost* alike, but are pronounced differently.
Actually, I was referring to different forms:  <Rad> and <Rat>
are homophonous in the singular, and yet are phonologically
distinct in the plural:  <Räder> /RE:d@/ and <Räter> /RE:t@/.
This does bear on the criticism of a true phonemic system, since
a true phonemic system will fail to capture phonological
neutralizations like that in the German data I presented.
That is, /Rat/ is really two distinct words: /Rat/-1 and /Rat/-2,
which German's *morphophonological* spelling system captures
because it *ignores* the phonological homophony in order to
satisfy another goal, semantic difference.

In other words, purely phonemic scripts, which would insist on
one written form for the two meanings of /Rat/, may in fact be
less useful to the speakers involved. And afterall, writing's
_raison d'etre_ is to serve speakers interests, in whatever
way seems to them most useful. You cannot tell objectively
(and I think this was one of Nik's points) what the speakers
will feel is the most salient interest.

=====================================================================
Thomas Wier          "...koruphàs hetéras hetére:isi prosápto:n /
Dept. of Linguistics  mú:tho:n mè: teléein atrapòn mían..."
University of Chicago "To join together diverse peaks of thought /
1010 E. 59th Street   and not complete one road that has no turn"
Chicago, IL 60637     Empedocles, _On Nature_, on speculative thinkers

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