Re: USAGE: USAGE north-west IE diffusion (Re: USAGE:Yet another few questions about ...

On Tuesday, July 6, 2004, at 02:06 , Doug Dee wrote:

> In a message dated 7/6/2004 3:32:23 AM Eastern Daylight Time, andjo@FREE.
> FR
> writes:
>
>> Exactly whom did the Ancients include in these terms [Celtae/Keltai]?
>> In particular, did they include the Gauls?
>
> Julius Caesar famously wrote that one of the three parts of Gaul was
> inhabited "by a people called in their own language Celtae, in the Latin
> Galli
> [Gauls]." [H.J. Edwards' translation]
I now have it :)

Gallia est omnis diuisa in partes tres, quarum unam incolunt Belgae, aliam
Aquitani, tertiam, qui ipsorum lingua Celtae, nostra appellantur. Hi omnes
lingua, institutis, legibus inter se differunt.

Gallos ab Aquitanis Garunna flumen, a Belgis Matrona et Sequana diuidit.

Horum onmnium fortissimi sunt Belgae, propterea, quod a cultu atque
humanitate Prouinciae longissime absunt, minimeque ad eos mercatores saepe
commeant atque ea, quae ad effeminandos animos pertinent, important,
proximique sunt Germanis, qui trans Rhenum incolunt, quibuscum continenter
bellum gerunt.
--------------------------------------------------------

"All Gaul is divided into three part, of which the Belgae inhabit one, the
Aquitani [inhabit] another, and those, who are called Celtae in their own
language and Galli in our language, [inhabit] the third. All these
[peoples] differ among themselves in language, customs and laws.

The River Garonne separates the Galli from the Aquitani, and the Marne and
the Seine separate them from the Belgae.

Of all these [peoples] the Belgae are the bravest on account of [the fact]
  that they are furthest distant from the culture and civilization of the
[Roman] Province*, and least often do merchants visit them and bring them
those things which tend to make minds effeminate, and they are the closest
to the Germans who live across the Rhine and with whom they continually
wage war."

*The Roman province of Gallia Narbonensis, long Romanized before Caesar's
conquest of the rest of Gaul. It was often referred to simply as
'Prouincia' (the Province), hence the modern name 'Provence'.

I find his phrase "All these [peoples] differ among themselves in language,
  customs and laws' telling.

Browsing around on the Internet today, I find that Simon James is by no
means alone with his "The Atlantic Celts - ancient people or modern
invention?"  Professor John Collis of Sheffield University in the UK also
rejects the notion of British & Irish 'Celts' in an article "celtic
fantasy' in "British archaeological news", March 1994.

Bob Trubshaw discusses 'the Celtic Fallacy' on:
http://www.draeconin.com/database/celtic-true-false.htm

As he says: "No doubt all these niceties will not worry the likes of the
Celtic publishing bonanza. Truth is, after all, rarely as interesting as
well-honed fiction."   :)

Ray
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