Re: Conlang T Shirt

Gerald Koenig wrote:
>
> >From: "Grandsire, C.A." " <grandsir@...>"
> >Subject:      Re: Conlang T-shirt
>
> Really, what is the semantics of "Your language goes here" in English?
>
> I imagine a situation where a host says to a guest, "Your coat goes in
> this closet". Is it an imperative? I don't think so. It's like saying
> "Your coat belongs in this closet". It's information about the way
> things are done. Or a math teacher could say to a student, "The tens go
> in the second column from the right." It is a convention.
> It borders on an imperative but it doesn't seem to have the serious
> consequences that the subjunctive requires.
>
        Then not only I stick to my interpretation, but you showed me I was
right, because as for your example of the math teacher, in French the
math teacher would typically say: "Ecrivez les dizaines a gauche des
unites". In French the imperative can have simply a meaning of
description, saying "the convention is this one" and inplying that you
will have to stick to it, but not giving you any order. There are a lot
of examples in French (especially in school) where explanations are
given in the imperative form. It is not the semantics of the English
sentence that count here, but the semantics of the French sentence. The
sentence would really become an order (and wouldn't fit anymore) if it
was added "s'il vous plai^t" after. But without it, it can mean simply
an explanation.

        So the sentence "Mettez votre langue ici" seems to me the best one.

> Then again, I can imagine another situation where I am applying my
> update sticker to my license plate and the instructions from the
> California Motor Vehicle Department say "This sticker goes here" with a
> diagram. It's an order, it has consequences.
>
        This was also one of the ways I saw it, and the first reason why I gave
this translation first. But you showed me that even without any idea of
order, the imperative could still be used.

> Well, anyway, my translation for NGL just begged the question by
> simply calqueing the English, there's no attempt at interpretation.
> Some languages may not allow that.
>
        The French calque seems for me too ackward, so except if Mathias has a
better idea, I think Fabian should stick to my sentence "Mettez votre
langue ici".

> "Your signature goes here"
>
> Jerry.
>
--
        Christophe Grandsire

        Philips Research Laboratories --  Building WB 145
        Prof. Holstlaan 4
        5656 AA Eindhoven
        The Netherlands

        Phone:  +31-40-27-45006
        E-mail: grandsir@natlab.research.philips.com