Theiling Online    Sitemap    Conlang Mailing List HQ   

Re: JINSEI WA GEIJUTSU DE ARU (was: Getting started with a newborn lang)

From:J Y S Czhang <czhang23@...>
Date:Friday, March 8, 2002, 22:39
In a message dated 2002.03.08 03.16.39 AM, MES (suomenkieli@YAHOO.COM) writes:

>Hope you didn't think I was laughing at you, Chang!
Oh no. I know that ya were amused more at the situation (or at least _at_ my situation ;) [Good rule of thumb {or whatever digit/appendage ya count rules on (*) }: Humour is always situational - so never take it personally even when it is personal :) (*) ah!, ConCulture/ConLang idea right here, peeps!!!... How do you count or indicate _rules of thumb_, points of (un)conventional wisdom or nodes/modes of thinking/thought?
>Anyhow, I checked with my Japanese partner about this >phrase as well as the explanation I offered on the >difference between =geijyutsu= vs =gijyutsu=. >In regard to the latter, my explanation of the >difference between these words is correct. >=Geijyutsu= refers to "art(form)" and its kanji for >_gei_ is the same used for =geinojin, celebrity= (in >my previous emails, I kept writing =geijin= but that >should be =geiNOjin=... caught that after I sent >them!). =Gijyutsu= refers to "technique, skill" and >its kanji for _gi_ is the same used for =gijyutsusha, >technician=.
Intriguin' difference and neat morphic means of creating the lexical difference. It's one the "strategies" I am tryin' to incorporating into Lego (my ConLang). (BTW is there a specific linguistic term or terms for this? I vaguely recall there is...)
>Regarding the =Jinsei wa geijyutsu de aru=, Nobu >confirmed (and I knew this myself, although I probably >did not convey it in the earlier emails) that it is >grammatically correct. He agreed with me that =de >aru= copula gives a rigid impression, but he also >explained to me that there was a regionally-famous >artist who years ago said this! Therefore, it is ok >grammar-wise and usage-wise. In reality, though, >neither he nor I understand what it means exactly.
_Jinsei wa geijyutsu de aru_ is also the motto of PL Kyodan (Perfect Liberty Kyodan), one of the new "religions" of Japan.
>Both in Japanese and English -- life is art. Is this >to be taken literally or as a "colorful" expression or >what?
I was hoping both. But evidentally AFAIK/IMHO the PL Kyodan interpretation is the less colourful literal one.
>Now you have it! Your original can be accepted >- sorry for the inconvenience. Nobu also commented >that my version =Jinsei to iu mono wa, kinchou na >geijyutsu to ieru deshou= is also grammatically ok, >but the meaning is toned-down and better-defined (ie, >hence, not a 1:1 translation from "life is art" if >that makes sense).
As ya can see below I like yours better! I think yours is closer in tone to the Liezi quote, too. I would exactly say your version is "toned down and better-defined"; I would say it is more "open-ended" and open to personal interpretations. Both quotes have a "questioning" or "probability" in their tone. Thanx, again MES... ~§~ "...So what is life for? Life is for beauty and substance and sound and colour; and even those are often forbidden by law [socio-cultural conventions]. . . . Why not be free and live your own life? Why follow other people's rules and live to please others?..." ~Lieh-Tzu/Liezi, Taoist Sage (c. 450- c. 375 BCE) ~~~ <<..."Per cosa è la vita? La vita è per la bellezza, e sostanza, e suono, e colore; e anche quelli sono spesso proibiti da legge [convenzioni socioculturali]. ...Perchè non siete liberi, e vivete le vostre proprie vite? Perchè seguite le regole altrui vivendo per piacere ad altri?...>> ~~~ Liezi, Saggio Taoista (c. 450- c. 375 BCE) ~§~ jinsei to iu mono wa, kinchou na geijyutsu to ieru deshou ~§~ <from Japanese> = lit. "one can probably say that 'life' is a precious artform")