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Re: Natlang most similar to your conlang [WAS: Analyzing Ayeri's syntactic and voice alignment (long)]

From:Benct Philip Jonsson <melroch@...>
Date:Friday, April 4, 2008, 16:06
That was exactly my thought, that it might be easier to have an
intuition WRT the a and i scores than WRT the g score. Of course
intuitions and intentions may always fail you. I for one find it
interesting when conlangs so to speak take on a life of their own and
intuition takes me places where intention never meant to go.

2008/4/4, Dirk Elzinga <dirk.elzinga@...>:
> Thanks for the comments, BP. The *category* would still be "M", but instead > of the features "a" and "i", you have "Green" or even just "g". Perhaps > instead of obligatorily replacing the older features, it can be left up to > the analyst to do so or to use the older ones. I was quite surprised to see > that Miapimoquitch only scored 2.43; I would have thought it would be > higher. And this tells me something about Miapimoquitch that I didn't know > before. So I think it is essential, for the "g" measure at least, to create > longer texts. If your language is only attested in inscriptions (for > example), then you will have no basis for determining a "g" score. But you > will likely also have little basis for determining "a" and "i" scores as > well, aside from your intuitions as the creator (but even then, your > intuitions can fail you; they did me in the case of Miapimoquitch). > > Dirk > > On Fri, Apr 4, 2008 at 8:49 AM, Benct Philip Jonsson <melroch@...> > wrote: > > > I like the idea of a morph per word ratio, but I can see a couple of > > problems with it: > > > > * it should still be called M rather than anything based on Greenberg, > > please! > > * For a conlang which lacks longer texts it may be hard to calculate > > accurately. > > > > 2008/4/2, Dirk Elzinga <dirk.elzinga@...>: > > > Thanks, Philip. > > > > > > A couple of things occurred to me as I reread my deathless prose from > > 2003. > > > In that version of the Language Code, I have: > > > > > > M morphology > > > a agglutinating (+/-) > > > i isolating (+/-) > > > > > > I think that these features can be replaced with a single feature, Green > > > (short for Greenberg). This feature is the ratio of morphs to words and > > is > > > expressed as a real number. For example, Miapimoquitch is 2.43. That is, > > on > > > average there are 2.43 morphs per word. I think this is a more accurate > > > reflection of the agglutinating/isolating dimension and isn't too hard > > to > > > figure out, given some amount of text. Joseph Greenberg, of typological > > > fame, proposed this (and other ratios) as a measure of morphological > > > typology. > > > > > > Also in this version of the Language Code, I claimed that English has 24 > > > consonants and 9 vowels. For the record (which is also in the archives) > > this > > > is not correct, and should be more like 14 or 15 for American English > > and > > > 19-22 for British English. Consult the archives for a nice little > > discussion > > > of this. > > > > > > Dirk > > > > > > On Wed, Apr 2, 2008 at 8:55 AM, Philip Newton <philip.newton@...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > On Wed, Apr 2, 2008 at 3:42 PM, Dirk Elzinga <dirk.elzinga@...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > Many years ago I proposed a "Language Code," which was intended to > > > > provide a > > > > > typological profile for a given constructed or natural language. It > > > > should > > > > > still be in the archives somewhere. > > > > > > > > Here's Take 4: > > http://archives.conlang.info/ge/suezhae/qhuevhunwhian.html > > > > > > > > Cheers, > > > > Philip > > > > -- > > > > Philip Newton <philip.newton@...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Miapimoquitch: Tcf Pt*p+++12,4(c)v(v/c) W* Mf+++h+++t*a2c*g*n4 > > Sf++++argh > > > La----c++d++600 > > > > > > > > > -- > > / BP > > > > > > -- > Miapimoquitch: Tcf Pt*p+++12,4(c)v(v/c) W* Mf+++h+++t*a2c*g*n4 Sf++++argh > La----c++d++600 >
-- / BP

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Mr Veoler <veoler@...>