Re: new lang: karath

On Fri, 6 Dec 2002 18:43:58 -0800 Joseph Fatula <fatula3@...>
writes:
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Robert B Wilson" <han_solo55@...>
> To: <CONLANG@...>
> Sent: Friday, December 06, 2002 3:45 PM
> Subject: new lang: karath
>
>
> > here's a new conlang i've made.
> >
> > phonemes:
> >
> > p       [p]
> > b       [b]
> > t       [t]
> > d       [d]
> > k       [k]
> > g       [g]
> >
> > r       [4]
> > l       [l]
> >
> > h       indicates a fricative (<ph>=[f], <dh>=[D]); rh=[r], lh=[l]
>
> Unless I'm mistaken, "lh" and "l" represent the same sound?  That's
> allowed,
> but I'm just checking if that's so or just a typo.
yes, they both represent the same sound.

> > n       indicates a nasal (<pn>=[m_0], <dn>=[n]); rn=[r], ln=[L]
>
> Same question here, "rn" and "rh" seem the same.
yep.

> > w       indicates labialization (<tw>=[t_w], <kw>=[k_w])
> > j       indicates palatalization (<tj>=[t_j], <kj>=[k_j])
>
> Are these examples the only labialized and palatalized consonants?
> For
> example, could I have "gw" or "dnj"?
no, they are not the only labialized and palatalized consonants.
there can be "gw", "dnj", or even "tnwj" (a labialized palatalized
voiceless nasal... i bet no natlang has that :))

> > a       [@]
> > e       [Ei]
> > i       [ae]
> > o       [au]
> > u       [M]
> > â       [a]
> > ê       [i]
> > î       [Ei]
> > ô       [oU]
> > û       [u]
>
> Hmm... you've got an interesting transcription scheme for the
> vowels.  And
> again, it looks like two of them are the same, "e" and "î".
yep.

> > direct article: -h-
> >         _geb_ 'word', _gheb_ 'the word'
> >         _kar_ 'person', _khar_ 'the person
>
> How do you know where to put the "-h-"?  Is it always after the first
> consonant, or before the last vowel?  If "kobîln" means "cowboy",
> then is
> "the cowboy" : "khobîln" or "kobhîln"?
usually before the last vowel.  in compounds the -h- goes before the last
vowel of the head word.

> > cases:
> > Agent                   -
> > Patient         -e-
> >         agent _kar_, patient _kaer_
>
> Same question regarding placement of infixes.
usually after the last vowel, after the last vowel of the head word in
compounds.

> > genitive                -a
> > instrumental    -he
> >
> > number:
> > singular        -
> > dual            bo-
> > <a few> -wi
>
> I take it you don't know the term for this - not surprising as it's
> not all
> too common.  The term I've seen is "paucal", sometimes defined more
> specifically as "less than ten" or some such.
okay

> > plural  -î-
> >         _kar_, pl. _kaîr_
> >
> > verbs:
> >
> > aorist  -
> > present -a
> > past            -ê-
> > future  -lô
> >
> > continuative    -a-
> > perfective              -ê
> > futurative              -lô-
> >
> > abilitive               bnâ-
> > obligative              -ô-
> > desirative              -tnukh
> > optative                -(e)tnkhetn
> > subjunctive             -h
> > imperative              -i
> > interrogative   wô-
>
> You've got a pretty large set of mood/aspect markers here, rather
> interesting.  Is there any reason why some are prefixes and others
> suffixes?
> And when is the (e) required? i.e., what sorts of consonant clusters
> are
> allowed?
the two that are prefixes were originally independent words. _bnâ_ is
related to the verb _bnâl_ meaning 'to be able'. _wô_ is the
interrogative pronoun.
_-tnukh_ and _-(e)tnkhetn_ were originally phrases.
the (e) is required when a cluster of four consonants (nasals,
fricatives, labialized, and palatalized consonants each count as one
consonant) would result or when a cluster CRC (C=any consonand, R='r',
'l', or any nasal) would result.

> > personal pronouns:
> >         pat.    agnt.
> > 1sg     dne     -(e)tn
> > 1pl     bnê     -(e)bn
> > 2sg     te      -(e)d
> > 2pl     pê      -(e)p
> > 3sg     ke      -(e)g
> > 3pl     tê      -(e)t
>
> Does the suffix here go on the verb or the pronoun?
on the verb

> > adjectives:
> > an adjective is prefixed with a vowel that is also prefixed to the
> noun
> > that it modifies.
> > _bnul_ 'tall'; _kar_ 'person'; _abnul akar_, _akar abnul_, _ebnul
> ekar_,
> > _ekar ebnul_, etc. 'tall person'
>
> I don't understand this part here.  Do you mean that any vowel
> prefix on an
> adjective is also prefixed to the noun it modifies, or that if a
> noun has a
> vowel prefix, that it is prefixed to the adjective?
the vowel prefix is used to show what noun and adjective go together.
the prefix can be any vowel as long as the same vowel is prefixed to the
adjective and the noun.
this can also be used with verbs and nouns to avoid possible ambiguity.

> Looks interesting so far, I'd love to see a sample of the language
> written
> out.  Or better yet, a sound clip of it!
here's a sample:

bhaêrg murkat ral ghaerdn othadn khaêrg ethak etal ekea êdnadn otor
obnabnar phaldnhlô bno kae e arathlô abhilnathen

love.PAST.3sg God.AGNT so_much world.DEF.PAT therefore give.PAT.3sg
e.son.PAT e.only 3.3sg.GEN so_that o.one_who o.beleive die.FUT.SUBJ not
that.PAT and a.live.FUT.SUBJ a.forever

> Joe Fatula
Robert Wilson
http://kuvazokad.free.fr/
Yessessë Eru ontanë Menel ar Cemen.
Yessessë ëa Quetta ar Quetta né as Eru ar Eru né Quetta.

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