Re: German 'duzen' and 'siezen' - etymology ?

Charlie wrote:
> >--- In conlang@yahoogroups.com, "Mark J. Reed" <markjreed@...>
> wrote:
>
> >If I may briefly attempt to drag this thread kicking and screaming
> >back toward the original question...
>
> >Does Spanish have an equivalent verb to totoyer/duzen/etc?  I've
> never
> >heard one...
>
> The verb is "tutear."
Right.  In Argentina and some other regions, there's also "vosear", to use
vos + (modified) 2nd pl. for the familiar-- vos hablás, vos tenés, vos decís
etc. (for habláis, tenéis). The familiar imperative also uses a modified
plural form for regular verbs: hablá for hablád, -é and -í for er and ir
verbs (can't summon up exs. at the moment ;-( )  For 2nd plural, both
familiar and formal, it's ustedes + 3rd pl. as usual.  Neither the tú nor
the correct vosotros forms are used at all IIRC.

On Span.-lang. Ideolengua, almost everyone tutear's, and the Spaniards use
the vosotros forms on occasion. Argentines sometimes use the vos forms,
which pass without comment. There's hardly an Usted in sight....

Then in Brazilian Port., there's "vocear", to use vocé for the _formal_ 2d
pers., I think with a 3rd pers. verb form, since there's no equiv. to usted.
It seems much chummier than correct "o/a senhor(a)".  Brazilians seem also
to use "Senhor [first name]" in formal but friendly situations-- when I was
calling on bookstores and universities, I was always Senhor Roger right off
the bat, never Sr. Mills (which they mangled to ['miuS] in any case). It's a
nice compromise.

> But, like Henrik, I don't care to be on an intimate footing with
> everyone who comes down the pike.  If a salesperson addresses me by
> my
> first name, I tell them, "Please don't call me by my first name.  We
> are total strangers."
I'm often tempted to say that, but it seems uppity, somehow....

Once in my first Span. conversation class, we had a substitute teacher, a
young man recently out of Cuba (this was in the 60s)-- he asked us to
introduce ourselves, and I was first in line (also probably older than the
teacher :-( ) -- I said "Soy Sr. Mills" and he hit the ceiling, telling me I
was being, in effect, snooty and superior, and said "Soy [Roger Mills]" was
the only proper way. (Our regular teacher, an older woman of some
distinction, always addressed us as Sr/Srta.)

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