Re: Status of Italian rising

Joseph Fatula wrote:

>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Tristan" <kesuari@...>
>To: <CONLANG@...>
>Sent: Monday, December 09, 2002 11:48 PM
>Subject: Re: Status of Italian rising
>
>
>I was under the impression that "data" would be pronounced /d&id@r/ in
>Australia.  Does the "r" sound only show up between vowels?  And when does
>Australian English add an /r/ that isn't written anyways?  Are there other
>languages where this form of rhotacism has happened?
>
>
[Note on IPA transcriptions that follow: when talking of things before
now, I use RP vowels. When talking of things that are now, I use
Australian vowels. Except with I/i and U/u, if you treat capital and
lower-case vowels as interchangeable, confusion shouldn't ensue. [r]=the
English R, not a trill.]

I dunno about other languages, but to the best of my knowledge,
non-rhotic dialects of English simply do not allow an R anywhere but
before a vowel. To be rid of them, it generally lengethened the previous
vowel, unless the previous vowel was tense, in which case it was
generally replaced by a schwa (the vowel+schwa diphthongs then often did
varying things, in my dialect:
    I@ --> /I@/ normally [I@], [I:] before /r/, /l/ and in some other
words (e.g. beer [bI@], beery [bI:ri], beard [bI@d] or [bI:d]).
    E@ --> /e:/ (e.g. bear [be:])
    U@ --> /o:/ unless following a /j/, when it becomes /ju;.@/ (two
syllables). Exceptions (like tour=/tu;.@/, your=/jo:/) exist.  (e.g.
sure [so:], pure [pju;.@] (surer [so:r@], purer [pju;r@]))
    O@ --> /o:/ (no example provided because I don't know which words
were /O@/ before /O@/ merged with /O:/).

(As a side comment here, I think probably that there was an historical
/A@/ prior to it merging with /A:/, but I can't say anything definitive.)

(In stressed syllables, the reflex of the sounds written <ur>, <ir>,
<wor>, <e(a)r> (hurt, bird, word, heard) is normally /3:/; this rounds,
is raised, and fronted some in Australia to /8:/ and fronted even more
in NZ to the slashed-o. In unstressed syllables, you just get a plain
old /@/.)

A new rule then popped up saying that you can't have two vowels next to
each other (hiatus becomes illegal?). To solve this, [r] was generalised
intervolically with non-high tense vowels.* With high tense vowels,
either [j] or [w] is used, depending on roundedness. These sounds are
non-phonemic, at least intermorphemically, especially when not written
orthographically.

*This makes perfect sense: the difference between [Ar] and [A:] was
neutralised except before a vowel into [A:]. Before a vowel, you had
[A:r] versus [A:]. Most words in English begin with consonants, so word
finally the normal form will be [A:]. With nothing to remember which is
which by, a rule developed that basically said it was [A:r] before a
vowel, [A:] elsewhere. [r] will *always* be a part of the next syllable;
aren't onsets nice?

Does that answer your question?

>>I used it as a wildcard. There's at least three realisations in use
>>around here: /a:/ (dahta), /&i/ (dayta) and /&/ (datta). Hence the
>>comment of 'realisation of choice on that particular vowel.
>>
>>
>That explains that.  I'd have to say that what I picture from an Australian
>would be /d&id@rIz/, but I don't know too many.
>
That's probably just because you're only used to hearing the ay-vowel in
'data', I'm guessing. And seeing as some Aussies will use the ay-vowel,
that just gave you that expectation. I generally say /a:/ myself, except
in some compounds like database.

>>Is the -t- really phonemically /d/? It's often pronounced voiced
>>hereabouts, but in careful speech and the like, it's certainly a /t/.
>>And is the /e:/ really a monophthong? (If I read '/de:d@Iz/' and
>>converted to spelling, I'd make it <dairda is> or <dairder is>, which
>>would go back to /de:d@rIz/, but mean absolutely nothing ;) )
>>
>>
>The "t" in "data" is definitely voiced.  In ex-trem-ly care-ful speech it
>might be /t/, but I'd pronounce it as a /d/ regardless of situation.
>
>A long-a as I speak it is usually /ei/, but in this instance it is
>definitely /e:/.
>
Okay then. Be that way. :P

Tristan.

>
>

Reply