YAEPT: apples and oranges (was Re: 'noun' and 'adjective' (fuit: To What Extent is Standard Finnish a Conlang?))

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On Fri, Mar 3, 2006 at  1:35 PM, Benct Philip Jonsson wrote:

> Mark J. Reed skrev:
>
> >> I once read an Anglophone phonetician pointing out
> >>the difference in intonation between the compound _orange juice_ meaning
> >>"juice made of oranges" and the adjective + noun phrase _orange juice_
> >>meaning "any juice of orange color": the compound has stress only on
> >>_orange_ while the phrase has stress on both _orange_ and _juice_.
> >>By that criterion _apple pie_ is a compound!
> >
> >
> > ?  Not the way I say it;  "apple pie" has equal stress on both words.
> > When I say it with the stress only on "apple", the result sounds like
> > someone speaking with a marked foreign accent.
>
> Being tone deaf I might well have gotten the details of the
> stress wrong, but you have to agree that _apple pie_ has the
> same stress pattern as the "juice made of oranges"
> version of _orange juice_, whichever the actual realization
> is, don't you (and Ray)?
As for this transatlantic native speaker, I'd say that the /'Or\ndZu:s/
pronunciation is distinctly Leftpondian, and I'd expect /'Qr\i\ndZ 'dZu:s/ in
the UK, much like /'r\Abnh@d/ vs /'r\QbIn 'hUd/, and AFAICT /'&pl=paj/ vs
/'ap@l 'pAj/, though I've heard it as both a compound and a phrase in this part
of the USA, along with cherry, pecan, pumpkin and sweet potato variants.

Actually, now I roll the various pies around in my head, I think the compounded versions
are a little more common around here.




Paul