Re: How to do "But/However"

Hi,

Matahaniyà ang Angosii Arthaey:
> Emaelivpeith taliesin:
>> 1. How do your conlangs handle but/however?
>
> In Asha'ille, _kret_ "but" derives from _kre'te_ "not and"
> or
> "<negation> and". Simple "and" is _te_. Both precede the
> joined
> clause, as in English.
>
> Not terribly original, but it's what I've got. :)
Ditto.

> But since I'm
> lacking in more nuanced conjunctions, perhaps I still have
> the chance
> to add some originality in there somewher. :P
I've never spent much thought on Logic, so Ayeri just goes
with _nay_, 'and' and _nárya_, 'but; although, though' <
*nay-arya, 'ANTI-and'. Originally, I included 'nevertheless'
in 'nárya' as well, but now I think I shouldn't. 'Nárya' was
originally meant as a catch-all expression for
contradictive (?) conjunctions ('entgegenstellende
Konjunktion' is the term in question). I'd be tempted to use
an own word for 'however', since this one has another
character than 'but' in my opinion. It's like saying 'apart
from what I said -- although I don't deny it -- I would do
X', so I'm not sure if 'however' really expresses a
contradiction.
Harald Stoiber is not unright in saying what he said -- he
generalized and theorized the use of 'but' --, but still my
language instinct keeps telling me that 'but' implies an
unexpected result. So when you say, "The apple is red but
tasty", this means at least in *my* understanding that red
apples aren't necessarily tasty. Is that Cognitive
Linguistics what you're talking about, Harald? John Quijada
wrote about this topic on the ZBB some time ago and the
examples you gave seem similar to those of John to me.

As for the etymology of the German word 'aber', the Duden
Etymologic Dictionary writes:

| ABER: The word used as an adverb, conjunction and particle
| (MHG _aber, aver_, OHG _avur_) is an old comparative form
| of the IE root *apo- "away", which is treated under -> AB.
| Accordingly, it originally meant something along the lines
| of "further away" thus, like the related Goth. _afar_,
| "after, later" and the Old Indic _aparám_ "later".
|
| In German the meaning "again" developed from "further
| away, (later)", compare for example 'tausend und
| abertausend' and 'abermals'. The use of 'aber' as
| an expression of something contradictive developed from
| the use of the word to express means of repetition.
|
| However, in earlier times, 'aber' also expressed the
| direction to the wrong, see -> Aberglaube and ->
| Aberwitz.

I still don't understand how the repetition of something is
related to something contradictive.

Greetings,
Carsten Becker

... being annoyed by his English teacher always saying
/'rE.vju:/ instead of /ri.'vju:/ -- as if it were written
*revview.

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