On Sat, 11 Sep 1999, FFlores wrote:
> andrew <hobbit@...> wrote:
>=20
> > Question I forgot to ask: Because the TRANS was written by a 10-year-ol=
d I
> > deliberately translated it without using the past definite tense. So I
> > want to put a question to the Romanophones on this list; would this be
> > normal? Or would it be expected that a pupil in their 4th or 5th year =
at
> > school would know how to use the past definite (or historic) tense in
> > their written work?
>=20
> What do you mean by 'past definite'? I'll try to guess...
> Spanish has two pasts, _pret=E9rito indefinido_ and _pret=E9rito imperfec=
to_.
> I guess your 'past definite' is the _indefinido_, in spite of the name:
>=20
> pret. indefinido: _fuimos de viaje_ 'we went on a trip'
> pret. imperfecto: _=EDbamos de viaje_ 'we were (going) on a trip'
>=20
"bamos"? :)
I think your analysis is correct. Brithenig also has compound tenses used
somewhat like Spanish, I gather (which Kernu doesn't have).=20
> If that's the meaning of your past definite, then I would say no,
> in principle. Spanish-speaking children know the difference and use
> what fits best. What past did you use in Brithenig? I guess the=20
> imperfect one, right? In any case, how you use it depends on the=20
> idiosyncracies of Brithenig speakers. In Spanish at least, using
> _=EDbamos de viaje_ for the completed action instead of _fuimos de
> viaje_ would be very strange even for a child.
Andrew used the imperfect, I think. I tend to agree with your position on
learning which tenses to use early on, though.=20
> Something a child *could* do is to use present tense for everything
> when telling a story (just as in English and I'm sure many other langs),
This is what happened in the Kernu version, though not 100%. The writer
alternates between present and perfect, but I think avoids the imperfect
altogether. There's a pretty clear distinction between imperfect and
perfect; and I think children would learn right usage early on. Certainly
by 5th grade (even in the US!) one already has a good idea on which tense
to use. I don't really think it's realistic to think children can't
figure out which to use.
Padraic.
> except for the first sentences while s/he sets the scenario.
> I haven't done that in Drasel=E9q... I'll have to think about it.
>=20
>=20
> --Pablo Flores
>
http://draseleq.conlang.org/pablo-david/
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