Re: ELVES: was: Elliott's peoples
| From: | Jörg Rhiemeier <joerg_rhiemeier@...> |
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| Date: | Tuesday, March 25, 2003, 13:30 |
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Sally Caves <scaves@...> wrote on Mon, 24 Mar 2003 13:14:40 -0500:
> [...] What I want to know from
> those of you who use the term "Elvish" to describe your own languages or
> peoples (that means you, Elliott, and you Joerg) is what you mean by this
> term. Are these a people like Tolkien's Elves? I.e., preternaturally
> beautiful, gifted, immortal, the original linguists and artists, the noble
> ancestry of a world which they have left for an Undying Land, and of a
> different race from that of ordinary humans? Or do you mean something else?
In fact, my "Elves" are no separate race at all, and not preternaturally
beautiful, gifted, immortal, etc., though in history, the belief that they
were was fairly common. They are the descendants of a unique civilization
that existed in the British Isles before the Celts got there. The "Elves" do,
however, believe that their purpose (in fact, the purpose of all humankind)
is to create and to enrich the world. This belief inspired them to create great art.
They also have a long-standing linguistic tradition; in the heyday of their
civilization, there was a great grammarian (comparable to Panini in India)
who codified the standard form of the Elvish language. Overall, their culture
is similar to that of Tolkien's Elves, but also shows "Celtic" traits.
> If you mean something else, why have you co-opted the word, which is now
> so deeply associated with Tolkieniana?
Well, "Elves" is mainly a term of convenience I use as long as I haven't found out
what these people call themselves. The reason why I call them "Elves" is
the idea that the Celtic and Germanic traditions of elves are a distorted
memory of the old civilization in pre-Celtic Britain. According to the Germanic
belief, the elves lived in a land in the west beyond the sea (and guess where
you end up when you sail westward from Germany); the Celts believed
that the elves (called Tuatha De Danann in Ireland) lived on the British Isles
before they arrived there themselves. The "Elves" might also be the
Hyperboreans and perhaps also the Atlanteans of Greek myth
(think about it: Plato's description of Atlantis fits Britain quite well).
> I.e., what is the popularity of this term? Its Otherworldliness? Its
> association with Tolkien? Magic? Its association with High Fantasy? (I
> can relate... I was enamored of the Elves in graduate school when I was
> rereading LotR).
I also was, and still am, enamoured with Tolkien's Elves. In fact, my Elves
started as a modern-day version of Tolkienian Elves, and their language
as a descendant of Sindarin. But I soon came up with the idea that they
are in fact the descendants of a prehistoric civilization of the British Isles
and not a separate race with preternatural traits at all.
> And finally, are Elves associated, in some way, with "Celticity"? Both
> Elliott and Joerg in their public surveys write that they have taken their
> inspiration for their "Elvish" from Celtic languages, as did Tolkien.
Well, first of all my idea of what an "Elvish" language sounds like
is largely shaped by Tolkien's language, and I am also attracted by
Celtic. But the similarity of "Elvish" and Celtic also makes sense
as both peoples have been living next door to each other for more than
2000 years. This resulted in a co-evolution of the languages and cultures
of both peoples. Thus, modern Elvish is similar in sound to Welsh,
complete with similar initial mutations. Elvish artwork and music are
also similar to their Celtic counterparts.
...brought to you by the Weeping Elf and the letter "ö"
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