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PIE *tk^ (was Re: Nostratic (was Re: Schwebeablaut (was Re: tolkien?)))

From:Jörg Rhiemeier <joerg_rhiemeier@...>
Date:Sunday, December 21, 2003, 20:13

On Sun, 21 Dec 2003 11:16:58 -0700,
Muke Tever <hotblack@...> wrote:

> On Sun, 21 Dec 2003 15:38:20 +0100, Jörg Rhiemeier > <joerg_rhiemeier@...> wrote: > >> If we presume that the original root was > >> *layakWa, penultimate accent and vowel-reduction would have given > >> *lyakW. But that form is clearly not the root for PIE; is it possible > >> that *laikW was reached via metathesis? > > > > Why not posit *likWa? The problem arises only because you insist > > on a one-vowel system ***which is not attested in any language***. > > I have half a mind to invent a zero-vowel conlang, where only the > consonants are phonemic. Vowels would arise in descendents because > anaptyctic schwas would naturally appear, and a uniform stress may or may > not arise... analogy might put vowels in places where they wouldnt have > been expected to begin with.
My conlang Proto-Hesperic can be described as having a single vowel segment to which autosegmental vowel features attach. But that's not really a one-vowel language, let alone a no-vowel language. It's just a language with an elaborate system of vowel harmony, ablaut and umlaut.
> >> >> PIE was fairly lenient on consonant clusters. > >> > > >> >Which suggests that quite a number of vowels were lost. > >> > >> Exactly. Furthermore, there are apparently many instances of the > >> cluster -tk- in PIE. Another language group with this feature is > >> Kartvelian. > > > > Yes. Paul Bennett goes as far as positing a series of dental-velar > > doubly articulated stops (i.e., treating *tk as monophonemic), > > but that is untenable because forms with *tk- are zero grades, > > alternating with *tek-. > > No... *tk^eH1- "gain control, erwerben" and *tk^ey- "dwell" are full > roots, with separate o- and zero-grades (*tkoy-mo- > Gmc *haimaz 'home', > *tk^ey- > Ved kṣéti "dwells", *tki-teH2- > Gk κÏ?ίÏ?ηÏ,). > > And where does the full grade of *H2r=tk^os "bear" go?
There is Hittite _hartagga_.
> The voiced version of *tk^, (*dhg^h) also appears in full roots, *dhg^hem- > "earth",
The form *dheg^hom- also exists.
> *dhg^hu:- "fish", *dhg^hes- "yesterday".
Any way, the assumption that *tk^, *dg^ and *dhg^h are single phonemes is to be rejected. Merry Christmas, Jörg.


Muke Tever <hotblack@...>
Gary Shannon <fiziwig@...>