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Re: vulgarisms

From:Carlos Thompson <chlewey@...>
Date:Wednesday, November 11, 1998, 4:21
lucasso wrote:

> have you thought about low speech, vulgarisms and slangs? > i'm especially interested in vulgarity, what words may have vulgar mean=
ing,
> what can be vulgar?
I've always wonder this too. In comparing the natlangs I know, or have hear about, I've noted that wha= t is vulgar or offensive in some language is not in some others. Even in some= dialects/accents of Spanish, there are differences between what is vulgar= or offensive and what is not. Commonly in Spanish, vulgarity is usually asociated with sex. If I remem= ber correctly in Swedish vulgar words are more asociated with hell and deamon= ds. One of the acceptions of "to swear" in English is to be rude. "jurar" wo= uldn't be interpreted in Colombia in that sense. The other phenomena I've found is how values changes. Vulgar words chang= es. The history i heard says that the Spanish word "puta" (peyorative for hor= e) comes form a Italian word meaning "miss". Which wasn't vulgar becomes th= at. The Spanish verb "coger": "to take" or "to grep" has become vulgar in many Latinoamerican countries with a peyorative meaning of having sex. "Coger= " is still used in Colombia with the standard meaning "to take". Many vulgar words were meant to be rude and insultive. In Colombia (or a= t least in Bogota) many of those are commonly used with no rude meaning. They ar= e still vulgar (you wouldn't pronounce it at the board meating of your company) b= ut not rude. If you realy want to be rude to a man, specialy if you are a woman= , called him "cretino" which is not considered a vulgarity but is quite offensive. In other words: vulgarity is usually asociated with sex, but rudeness is usually asociated with lack of inteligence. Other common source of rude words are animals wich we asociated with nega= tive values (like opportunism, foul play or something like that). Examples in= Spanish are "rata", at some extend "perro" (dog) but "perra" (bitch) is f= ully rude (with similar meaning than English if I'm not mistaken). I remember= I once read that calling somebody "wild dog" was very offensive in some Arab cou= ntry.
> > AFAIK there are no 'civilisated' langs without that stuff, so whata bou=
t
> conlans?
I've found in sombodys conlang that politness should be necesary... I gue= ss this make rude and vulgar a phrase with no polite markings. I guess for the resurection of my personal language, I won't derive vulga= rity at a deep level, that's because I myself are not uset to vulgar speech, even= if my enviroment is plaged by that. Rudeness would probably be conceptual borr= owings from the languages I know (those which reflect my own thoughts) and scape= word (those "shit!" "f...!" and other words when only used for internal but exteriorized thoughts) would be shameless phonetical borrowings from what= evere word crosses my mind. If I ever begun seriously any of may ficlangs they would derive the vulga= rity from their cultures values. Well, thats all for know. -- o_o =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3Dw=3D=3D=3Dw=3D=3D=3D=3D####### Chlewey Thompin ## #### http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/9028/ ## ## ## ------------------------------------------------##-## ## ### - =BFPor qu=E9 no? - No tiene sentido. - =BFQu=E9 sentido? El sentido no existe. - El sentido inverso. O el sentido norte. El sentido com=FAn, tal ve= z. O sin sentido, como aqu=ED. (-- Graeville 2) -- o_o =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3Dw=3D=3D=3Dw=3D=3D=3D=3D####### Chlewey Thompin ## #### http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/9028/ ## ## ## ------------------------------------------------##-## ## ### - =BFPor qu=E9 no? - No tiene sentido. - =BFQu=E9 sentido? El sentido no existe. - El sentido inverso. O el sentido norte. El sentido com=FAn, tal ve= z. O sin sentido, como aqu=ED. (-- Graeville 2)