Re: Announcement: New auxlang "Choton"

Quoting Henrik Theiling <theiling@...>:

> Hi
> !
> Andreas Johansson <andjo@...> writes:
> > I wrote:
> > >   |Pfad|  /pfa:d/ [pfa:t]
> >...
> > Reminds me; is it really [pf]? Since it's usually described as an
> affricate, I
> > had assumed it's really [pp\] - which I find easier to pronounce, and in
> fact
> > is what I use when speaking German - but _every_ phonetic transcription
> I've
> > seen seems to write [pf].
>
> Ah!  Yes, it's [pf].  I just tried [pp\] and it is not perfectly
> right.
>
> Actually, it never occurred to me that [pf] cannot technically be an
> affricate because it's bilabial+labialdental, but I think it still is
> one:
>
> When I pronounce it, there is no need to adjust the position of the
> jaw to switch from bilabial to labiodental.  My upper teeth already
> touch the lower lip while the plosive is closed by the upper lip.
> When the plosive part opens, there is no need to adjust anything: the
> [f] is already perfectly in position for the fricative part.  So I'd
> say that although not exactly the same point of articulation, it is
> still an affricate since nothing is moved, since upper-lip with
> lower-lip and upper-teeth with lower-lip can touch at the same time.
That's one funny affricate! Trying it, I can just about manage it in isolation.
I won't be able to use it in connected speech anytime soon. It's just crying to
get transformed into either [pp\] or a labiodental affricate (which apparently
isn't IPAically representable).

Do your upper teeth touch you lower lip when producing a simple [p]?

                                                     Andreas

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