Theiling Online    Sitemap    Conlang Mailing List HQ   

Re: /k/ in i.t.a.

From:Mark J. Reed <markjreed@...>
Date:Friday, November 12, 2004, 22:13
On Fri, Nov 12, 2004 at 04:24:04PM -0500, Pascal A. Kramm wrote:
> On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 11:58:24 -0500, Roger Mills <rfmilly@...> wrote: > > >Fronting of velars before front V is also seen in the German ach-laut vs. > >ich-laut; both sounds presumably represent the same _phoneme_ /x/ though > >they are phonetically quite distinct. > > No, they don't represent the same. Exclusively "ch" in "Bach" represents > /x/, while "ch" in "ich" always represents /C/.
You're misunderstanding. No one is arguing that the *pronunciation* varies between [x] or [C] depending on environment. Roger's statement was that he believes the underlying phoneme to be the same. I don't know enough about German to know if he's correct. But what would be required for him to be *incorrect* is more than the fact that they sound different. The most direct indication that they're separate phonemes would be examples where the two pronunciations aren't in complementary distribution. The most straightforward such example would be a minimal pair - two otherwise-identical words with different meanings where one has [x] in the same place the other has [C] - but that's not the only possibility. -Marcos


Roger Mills <rfmilly@...>