Re: Knowledge-related roots in sabyuk

bac is utterly different from this, so i thought i'ld
pick out a few contrasts, and also a few ways it
achieves the same thing in different ways.

 --- julien eychenne <eychenne.j@...> wrote: >
>
> sabi : to know (something you learnt or you was
> taught, ``pure knowledge'')
> qenu : to know (something abstract you didn't
> especially learn or  wasn't taught (a date for
> instance))
> tlani : to know (someone or something concrete)
the primary root is |gap|=thought content

so |Gop|, |Gap| and |Gep| all mean 'to have a thought
content'. The difference is that a speaker uses |Gop|
when s/he considers the thought content to be true and
justified ( English use of 'know' ), |Gap| when no
such comment is made, and |Gep| when s/he considers it
either untrue, unjustified, or both. |Gap| usually
means 'think about', or sometimes, with a phrasal
extention 'think'.

if the object of the English verb is a person or
something concrete, bac _could_ use |Gop| or |Gep|,
but the meaning would be more 'knows about'. To give a
pure 'knows/would recognise' meaning, you could use,
for instance, the past tense or |Gaj| 'to see' and say
|sot Gawjh golher| 'i have seen/know' your mother.

>
>  kivà : to teach (general meaning)  (french
> ``apprendre'')
>  dirà: to teach (scholar meaning) (french
> ``enseigner'')
>
here you would do what bac does frequently and use
multiverb clauses:

sot Bac wher Gar
I say \you hear
I say to you

sot Bac wher Gep
I say \you believe
I tell you/I lie to you

sot Bac wher Gap
I say \you think-about
I tell you about

sot Bac wher Gop
I say \you know
I tell/teach you

> (i) Slux-ô-ki !
>     listen-Prospective-2person
>     'you will listen' == ''Listen''
>
> (ii) Hir-ô-ki !
>      listen-prosp-2pers
>      'you will listen'  == ''I have something to
> tell you''
you would probably say:

Garer
listen-you

but you could say

Garer Gop
listen-you know &c

>
> (iii)        Ye-n      mat-ni        sabyàj-na.
> definite_plural-1pers look-1pers grammarian-ACC
>    ``We are looking at the sabyàjà (how he looks
> today, his cloths...)''
>
> (iv)  Ye-n            kath-ni        sabyàj-na
> definite_plural-1pers look-1pers grammarian-ACC
>    ``We are looking at the sabyàjà (who's giving a
> class, telling us smthg...)''
>

conversely the equivalent in bac would have a
different meaning:

sont Gaj sabyaja
we see/look-at \the-sabyaja
we look at the sabyaja

sont Gaj Gop sabyaja
we see/look-at know \the-sabyaja
we study/examine the sabyaja

for your meaning you would have to say:

sont Gaj sabyaja Bac shont Gop
we see/look-at \the-sabyaja speak \we know

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