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laterals (was: Pharingials, /l/ vs. /r/ in Southeast Asia)

From:Ray Brown <ray.brown@...>
Date:Saturday, February 7, 2004, 18:05
On Friday, February 6, 2004, at 10:21 AM, Andreas Johansson wrote:

> Quoting Ray Brown <ray.brown@...>:
>> Some languages, e,g, the Dravidian languages have a 'retroflex lateral', >> which, I guess, is a 'rhotic lateral'. > > As I mentioned shortly ago, some varieties of Swedish, including, since a > couple of years, mine, has a retroflex lateral.
Yes, I was aware of it, but had forgotten it. Thanks for reminding me. [snip]
>> I'm puzzled by lateral plosives and rhotic plosives. Lateral fricatives >> & >> lateral >> affricates I both understand and can pronounce easily enough. But lateral >> plosive >> puzzles me? What exactly is blocking the pulmonic airstream to cause the >> plosion? > > The IPA chart provides a diacritic for "lateral release", with a laterally > released 'd' as example.
True - but it also has diacritics for nasal release, with a nasally released 'd' as example. But I've never heard anyone talking about a 'nasal plosive' (prenasalized plosives, yes - they're not exactly uncommon. And I guess a plosive with nasal release could be described as post-nasalized). Also, as you say, the sign is a diacritic and marks _release_ - it does not mark the place where the stop or occlusion is made.
> I'm not clear how this differs, or if it differs, > from a voiced lateral affricate at the same POA, but abscence of friction > could be a possibility.
It did occur to me after writing the email that the |tl| in Nahuatl might denote this 'lateral plosive'. I'd always understood it to be a lateral affricate, i.e. [tK]. But then I recalled that we anglophones readily substitute a palatal affricate [tS] for the palatal plosive [c] in languages like Malay /Indonesian. Am I guilty of the same 'slackness' with regard to Nahuatl's |tl|? Ray =============================================== (home) (work) =============================================== "A mind which thinks at its own expense will always interfere with language." J.G. Hamann, 1760


Dirk Elzinga <dirk_elzinga@...>