Re: Voice question

Andreas Johansson <andjo@...> wrote:

> I ask because I'm currently working on a language that has strict word
> order (SOV, S-PO-SO-V for ditransitives), and a couple of voice
> suffixes: a passive that demotes the subject and promotes the object(s)
> (of transitives; intransitives end up ambient), and something I've been
> calling an "antipassive/applicative" that demotes the primary object
> (and promotes the secondary object to primary object position in
> ditransitives). I'm not sure how plausible this is. It's supposed to be
> like the difference between "He gave the dog a bone" and "He gave a bone
> (to the dog)" but marked with a suffix.
Very plausible indeed and exists in the best possible IAL---Indonesian (of
course :-))
That was part of a recent thread, I think--and I gave the example of the
Indonesian suffixes -kan/-i.

Petani me-nanam-i sawah. The peasant plants the paddy.
Petani me-nanam(-kan) nasi. The peasant plants the rice.
Sawah di-tanam-i (dengan) nasi oleh petani. The paddy is planted (with) rice
by the peasant.
Nasi di-tanam(-kan) di sawah oleh petani. The rice is planted in the paddy
by the peasant.

There's also a very handy resultive passive:
Sawah ter-tanam. The paddy is "planted up".

BUT I wish Indonesian was more consistant enough to allow the following:
*Sawah ter-tanam-i.
*Nasi ter-tanam-kan.

OBCONLANG

After trying a hundred tricks I ended up doing exactly the same in my
conlang (although the suffixes and clitics change their endings every second
day):

Kitali-pomiki a milamilato-tai pasila. The peasant plants the paddy.
Kitali-pomiki a milamilato(-nai) pitona. The peasant plants the rice.
Pasila a mi-milamilato-tai (ipai) pitona ikai kitali-pomiki. The paddy is
planted (with) rice by the peasant.
Pitona a mi-milamilato(-nai) itai pasila ikai kitali-pomiki. The rice is
planted in the paddy by the peasant.

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