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R: Re: Maps of Ill Bethisad.

From:Mangiat <mangiat@...>
Date:Wednesday, April 11, 2001, 14:36
Christophe wrote:

> En réponse à John Cowan <jcowan@...>: > > > > > What matters is that certain lexical items like "amor" /amur/ and > > "trobador" > > /trubadur/ are preserved so that they can spread to other langs. Not > > necessarily the spellings, of course, which are *here's* Standard > > Occitan. > > > > For /amur/, as I said there is no problem. The spelling is <amour> and the > pronunciation /a'mu/, but it was still /a'mur/ (flap r) until one century
ago, Do you really pronounce that /amu/? I must be stuck to 100 yrs ago, because I have always thought it was prononounced /amur/!
> so it shouldn't count. As for /trubadur/, if I knew the origin of the word
> what does it derive?),
Provençal: trobar clus, trobar lieu... B. de Ventadorn, B. de Born (sp?), Arnaut Daniel...
> I could say, but as I see it it is a little bit more > problematic since in Narbonósc intervocalic voiced stops become
fricatives, thus
> the corresponding word would be spelled <trouvadour> and pronounced in
> Narbonósc /truva'du/ (French has a cognate: trouvère /tru'vEr/). Still,
> to French, Narbonósc fricativization of intervocalic voiced stops is
rather late
> (end of the XVIIth century approximately. It seems to have been
> of the Revolution). So maybe other languages would have borrowed it before
> fricativization... Interesting word still. What's its origin? > > > > > > Which ones are you talking about? Maybe we can keep the etymology, and > > just > > > replace the word "Occitan" with the word "Narbonósc" :) . As I see it, > > earlier > > > forms of Narbonósc looked quite like Occitan. > > > > Oc! > > > > Indeed, Narbonósc for "yes" is ouc /u/ :) .
How odd... _ouk_ in Greek means exactly the opposite : ) Luca
> Christophe. > >


Christophe Grandsire <christophe.grandsire@...>