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Re : new language; langmaker

From:From Http://Members.Aol.Com/Lassailly/Tunuframe.Html <lassailly@...>
Date:Tuesday, July 20, 1999, 13:43
Dans un courrier dat=E9 du 19/07/99 21:14:24  , vous avez =E9crit :

> I need to share. I've been sketching a new language (called Meanate) wher=
> the only morphology is nominal. Or something like that. Here's an example=
: i was quite sure you would do that looking from your Asiteya grammar. let me quote a previous post of mine ;-) : -------------- quote anyway i like it (Asiteya) then because it combines ergative and nominative and active/patientive systems. (i think you have the full range needed cases for that) maybe a step towards another allnoun conlang ? ;-)=20 ------------- quote there are basically 2 kinds of allnoun conlangs : those to make all verbs from nouns and those to make all nouns into verbs. very different strategies ;-) anyway, i'm afraid you can't help using nouns of action and state like "seeing" because your human brain is like that. the problem with allnoun is that you can't cope with aspects very well because each noun you pick as predicate has a specific aspect which does not always agree with the aspects of other arguments. verbal voices are made to achieve such agreement, i.e., to refer to the various aspects of the whole process where arguments each play a role at a certain time ('aspectivation'). but in allnoun, you don't have voices anymore, so you have to cram aspect in cases. and if you want many nouns to have a potential role and become predicates in turn (like english does) you need as many cases as pairs of nouns. english just do that : stone > to stone a convict hammer > to hammer man > to man a ship dog > to dog the master ship > to ship goods flower > to flower etc. if you really want to make this clear, it can become fairly long : to stone =3D to throw stone at hammer =3D to beat with a hammer to man =3D to hire a crew for to dog =3D to follow your master as a dog usually does etc. making an allnoun language is just like that. the needed cases are like the verbs hidden in english noun-derived verbs. you usually start listing the cases of the few basic "official" systems (active/passive, ergative/absolutive, equative/attributive, volitive/unvolitive, etc). but then you may endlessly refine it. let me list you some of them according to the "vision" chosen : "active/passive vision" : i hurt john that's 2 cases : nominative accusative "ergative vision" : example : stative : make broken > broken / be broken attributive : make wound > wound / have wound terminative : make into breakings > breakings / become breakings that's 4 cases : ergative absolutive attributive terminative so it's 2+4 =3D 6 cases. "instrumental vision" user / instrument / fuel / material / facility / pattern / etc. transformative example (with result) : baker / oven / firewood / dough / receipe > bread processive example (no result implied) : cyclist / bycicle / road / etc. so that's 6 more cases : agentive instrumental fuelive :-) materialive :-) facilitive :-) patternive :-) so it's 6 + 6 =3D 12 cases. "role-attribute vision" it's a classic also called "trigger case system" by some conlangers : "X is Y's brother" "X is 10-meter large" "X makes Y be Z's chief" "zazie makes road 126 be my way" that's 2 more cases : status relative so it's 12+2 =3D 14 cases "experiencer vision" very chic. usually used for intellectual stuff : experiencer / faculty / "topic" / representation example : john (experiencer) sees (faculty) a tree (topic) john (topic) looks (faculty) stupid (perception) so it's 14+5 =3D 19 cases. "transfer vision" these are notional, not spatial or temporal cases. you may need : dependence (from, ab-) i take a cookie from you / you are my cookie provider impendence (to, ad-) i give you this / you receive this "equative vision" i am a man this is quite different from status because it points at nature, not role. then the spatiotemporal cases : locative (by, in) and 150 other ones if you want. you can make up your own ones too. i recommand : performive : i do-sport you may consider it's absolutive. ambulative : i go-round important one if you don't want to use "to go" ad nauseam. etc. so with 25 or so cases you should be a happy allnouner like i was once. hope you enjoy. mathias =20