Re: Old Norse (was Re: New to the list)
| From: | Padraic Brown <pbrown@...> |
|---|
| Date: | Saturday, June 17, 2000, 22:17 |
|---|
On Sat, 17 Jun 2000, Thomas R. Wier wrote:
>Padraic Brown wrote:
>
>> >And I think she misses
>> >her 'usted', poor thing (in Iceland, any single person is "þú", whether s/he
>> >is the president, a worker, an infant, or a cat). As regards English, the
>> >honorific pronoun has overtaken the normal 'thou' (I know you know that).
>>
>> Actually no. At best a quasi honorific. Only used when addressing God:
>> and that, I think, is only because in Latin he is addressed "tu".
>> I.e., a direct translation. If I remember right, there was a
>> flirtation in Middle English with honorific pronouns, but it never
>> caught on. I think using ye or you as a singular honorific.
>
>No, actually, what he said is right. "Thou" was always the standard
>singular second person pronoun, until sometime around Shakespeare's
>time, when "you", formerly only the second person plural, started to be
>used for the honorific singular second person. Eventually, it overtook
>it entirely, eliminating the singular/plural distinction.
You was used, at least intermittently, as an honorific in ME, as I
said. I don't know much about English between 1400 and 1800; so I'll
certainly take your word. I was speaking of "thou" as an honorific
above. I agree with you that an honorific "you" is formed and
eventually takes over; but once "you" takes over (almost) entirely,
it's rather moot to speak of it as an honorific singular anymore!
(Standard) English now doesn't have an honorific - at least in my
opinion - it has one form doing double duty for singular and plural.
Either that, or we "honour" everyone equally crappy. :)
> by Senator Ralph Izard of South Carolina upon the stout vice
> president: 'His Rotundity'."
:D The seedy side of these Founding Fathers we hold so dear!
Padraic.