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# Re: Number

From: claudio Sunday, August 5, 2001, 23:42
```@marcus smith

the conlang degaspregos electorium has a nice derivated numeral system.

the "absolutive aspect" expresses the numeral as noun.
the "cardinal aspect" expresses the numeral as adjective.
the "ordinal aspect" expresses the numeral as part of a sequence. (first,second,third,fourth,..)
times,five times,..)
the "fractional aspect" expresses the numeral as a fraction. (half,third,quarter,..)
the "multiplitive aspect" expresses the numeral as a multiplication.
(two-fold/double ,three-fold/tripple,..)
the "distributive aspect" expresses the numeral as distribution. (two for each,three for each,..)

examples:
"feed the dog eightfolded"
"feed the dog eight times"

{------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NB that forms are listed according to most frequent usage; derivational
morphology will allow for change of part of speech.

Numeral | Absolutive | Cardinal | Ordinal | Adverbial | Fractional | Multiplicative |
Distributives
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-o-,(noun) -a-,(adj) -t- -ei- -ot- -pel- -n- "X for each"

1       oinos (*oi-)    oinas      oinatas    oinei       -            oinapelei        oinanas
2       dwos (*dwô)     dwas       dwatas     dwei       dwotos        dwapelei         dwanas
3       tros (*tri-)    tras       tratas     trei       trotos        trapelei         tranas
..
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------}
(source: http://www.angelfire.com/tx/eclectorium/deganumerals.html)

but apart from exact numerals like this i distinguish 4 kinds of plural:

aspect 1: entity/timeless entirety
-essa =   the class of x in the abstract sense. e.g. "humans have two legs"
here, "humans" are not meant as "a few humans" and also not meant as "all humans".
theyre meant as "humans in general", though "in general" doesnt fit 100% as explanation.
also we can relate the entity to something, example: "mind" = the entirety of
mental processes/states of a lifeform.
here again we use the entity aspect with "mental processes" as timeless class,
but related to a individual lifeform (and not all lifeforms).
aspect 2: disassociative plural
-es = this is the standard plural as were used to it in english. e.g. "ants are
walking up the tree"
this aspect doenst specify any quantum.
aspect 3: asssociative plural
-eka =    groups/sets/collections/aggregates are dervied from this root. e.g.

aspect 4: sentimental quantums
4.1 qu-ar-a = "very many x"
4.2 qu-or-a = "many x"
4.3 qu-er-a = "medium-many x"
4.4 qu-ir-a = "few x", minority
4.5 qu-ur-a = "very few x"

( aspect 5: fraktive quantums (sentimental)     )
( 5.1 qu-a-rel(-a) = "all of x"                 )
( 5.2 qu-o-rel(-a) = "most of x", majority of   )
( 5.3 qu-e-rel(-a) = "half of x"                )
( 5.4 qu-i-rel(-a) = "least of x", minority of  )
( 5.5 qu-u-rel(-a) = "none of x"                )

"qu-" means quantum
"-rel-" means relative.

when you write:
"Rather than simply quantity, some number systems distinguish distributed
all over the place from collected in one place."
does this sentence refer to the associative plural ?

regards,
c.s.

SMA> On Sun, 5 Aug 2001, claudio wrote:

>> good day.
>> when we see plural as the strict meaning of "this and others additional",
>> then the english "we" is acutally an "exclusive we" (which is used as incl we as connotation)
>> AND the inclusive we can be logically split up into a singular-incl.-we and a plural-incl.-we
SMA> First person plural is certainly "I + others". The inclusive vs. exclusive
SMA> distinction determines whether the addressee is included in "others" or
SMA> not. The other pronouns can be purely "plural" meaning "more than one of".

SMA> The meaning "X + others" is often called the associative plural. Some
SMA> languages, such as Hungarian, distinguish "normal" plurals from
SMA> associative plurals.

SMA> Janos 'John'
SMA> Janos-ok 'John-PL' (more than one person called John)
SMA> Janos-ek 'John-Assoc' (John and others with him)
SMA> (Data from Corbett 2001)

SMA> Other languages with such systems are Central Pomo and Yup'ik.

SMA> Marcus

"rurmlor entflöt, fluppseveri trimel akre wopel larf."
- alte redensart
```