Re: Circumfixes and syllabic consonants

Pablo wrote :

Hi all!
>
Hi Pablo ! :-)

> I'd like to hear your opinions about the use of circumfixes.
> I'm planning to have quite a lot of them in a new conlang
> project, but it seems to me they are more the exception than
> the rule in natlangs. Anybody has stats about which natlangs
> use each kind of affix? (I mean, suffixes, prefixes, infixes,
> and circumfixes). Are circumfixes just a merge of prefix + suffix
> or something else?
>
That's an interesting question. I like infixes very much. I only know about
Indonesian and khmer where circumfixes are prefix+suffix. I give you most of
the Indonesian verbal pre/suf/circum/fixes in case it may interest you :

pukul = to beat
me-mukul  = to beat (mostly intransitive)
pukul-kan = to beat (mostly when word order is reversed)
me-mukul-kan = to beat (transitive)
me-mukul-i = to beat (directive)
mem-per-pukul-kan = to have someone beat
*pukul-an = a blow
per-pukul-an = process/result of beating
pe-mukul = *beater
pe-mukul-an = action of beating
ke-pukul-an = a blow (abstract) / to be beaten (antipassive)
ke-pukul-pukul-an = to pretend beating
di-pukul = to be beaten
di-pukul-kan = to be beaten
ter-pukul = (to be) beaten (passive state)
etc.
Javanese also have many infixes but I can't remember Javanese well anymore. Some
Indonesian words still keep (Javanese or other languages') infixions like
dan= 'and' => dengan = 'with'
Speaking of IAL, Indonesian is very suitable (it's a joke, I stop now, ok, ok :-)
Khmer infix -o/-u + nasal (there are other kinds but they are not logical anymore - too bad) :
thleak = to fall => t-um-leak = to fell
Also look at languages with reduplicated initials like Oceanian languages,
Sumerian, etc. It's great fun : taka / takka / taaka / tataka / takaka /
takataka. In one of my languages partial or total reduplication showed all
syntactic functions. In natlangs they usually show intensity, plural,
diversity, aspect. Christophe Grandsire wrote that he liked reduplication very
much when he read the Sumerian grammar I gave him. By the way, when will he
give it back to me ? Christophe, can you read me ?

> Also, syllabic consonants: how frequent are they? Have you
> ever used them? By "syllabic consonants" I mean consonant
> sounds that can be treated as vowels, i. e. they can form a
> syllable, and be stressed. I know at least Chinese has a syllabic
> "r". My new conlang is having lots of syllabic consonants; in
> fact, voiced fricatives can all be syllabic.
>
Japanese 'n' is counted as a syllable and is so pronounced (/n/, /m/ or /ng/) in poems
and songs. Also Khmer does that with aspirated initials : k'bal = head.

>
> --Pablo Flores
>
Mathias

> * If a princess kisses a frog and the frog doesn't become a prince,
> * let's not hurry into discarding the frog. Enchanted princes are
> * rare, but authentic princesses are not abundant either.
> *
> *     (Ana Marma Shza, "House of Geishas")
>
>


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