Re: Q (Caucasian Elf)

On Thu, 22 Feb 2001, jesse stephen bangs wrote:

> I'll say.  That's the largest consonant phonology I've ever seen, altho
> I've never studied an actual Caucasian language.  Perhaps those can be
> even larger.  I don't find the system personally appealing, as I prefer
> minimal phonologies, for the most part, but I admire that it's consistent.
> BTW, why are all of these sounds considered different phonemes?  Why
> doesn't anyone ever suggest that /tw/ is actually just /t/ + /w/, or that
> /t`/ is /t/ + /?/.  (I say 'anyone,' because I'm assuming that you're just
> following normal practice for linguists.)
Simple: because they're different sounds.  :)  A /t^w/ (with a superscript
w) is a /t/ made with rounded lips, *not* a /t/ followed by a /w/.  In the
same vein, /t'/ is a /t/ made with glotal pressure instead of lung
pressure.  So it's different from -- although might turn into -- a /t/
followed by a /?/.

> > CONSONANTS (I'm using modified Kirschenbaum here)
> >
> > Labials: p b p` f f~ v m w
> > Dentals: t d t` tw dw t`w r D n (T T~)
> > Alveolar: ts dz ts` s z tsw dzw ts`w sw ts~ ts~w dz` dz~w ts~` ts~`w s~ s~w
> > Retroflex: ts. dz. ts.` s. z. ts.w dz.w ts.`w s.w ts.~ ts.~w dz.~ dz.~w
> > Palatal: c J c` C j cw Jw c`w sw zw c~ c~w J~ c~` c~`w C~ j~
> > Lateral: tl> dl tl` hl l3 l tlw dlw tl`w slw tl~ tl~w dl~ dl~w tl~` tl~`w
> > hl~ hl~w (L)
> > Velar: k k` g x kw gw k`w x`w k~ k~w g~ g~w k~` k~`w x~ x~w (Q)
> > Uvular: q G q` X g" qw Gw q`w Xw g"w q~ q~w G~ G~w q~` q~`w X~ X~w
> > Laryngeals: ? h H ?- h- H- ?w hw Hw ?-w h-w H-w
Holy Buddha's left nipple, thasa lot of phonemes!

> Ahh, tone.  The bane of my existence.  Although I admire your language for
> its expansiveness, I would probably find it impronounceable and not very
> aesthetic.  But to each his own.
Tone *can* be very beautiful.  Hrondu has a tone accent, but a very, very
simple one.

Well, until you get into compound words.

--Pat


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