Re: elv ned'm concurrent pronoun systems

FFlores wrote:

> Joe Mondello <Rugpretzel@...> wrote:
>
> >  last night I discovered the following quirk of ned'm grammar.  There=
 are
> two
> > pronouns systems that are apparently unrelated.  when a verb is used =
with
> > pronoun system 1 it takes its meaning1.  when used with pronoun syste=
m2
> (the
> > weryool, or so called "pain pronouns"). They take a completely differ=
ent,
> > usually unrelated meaning.
>
> [snip]
>
> > e.g . loy     meaning1-to like, meaning2- to molest, touch against on=
e's
> will
> >
> > es loyu =F3rm mesh
> > I-1 like-1s sister of-you
> > I like your sister
> >
> > chay l=F3loy =F3rm mesh
> > I-2 past-molest sister of-you
> > I molested your sister
>
> Wow! This can get dangerous for unaware L2 speakers :-)
> What do you do when the subject is supposed to be a system2
> subject, but is not a pronoun? Do you use the pronoun anyway,
> or can you omit it anyhow? Also, what do the verb infinitives
> mean (meaning 1 or 2)? I'd like to hear more about the quirks
> of this double system. How do you assign the meanings in
> each case?
Ditto ditto ditto... I find this system fascinating, Joe, and want you to
elucidate it.  What would make such a language change the pronouns
to affect the verb?  Do you have another system of pronouns to
reflect, say, delight?  And like Pablo, I'm curious how you mark
subjects that aren't pronouns?  It seems immensely original but
ultimately unworkable and cumbersome.  But I'm drawn to it.
It's as though the speaker (or doer) has to change personalities to expre=
ss
delight, violence, or neutrality instead of familiarity or formality,
which it vaguely echoes.

Sally
scaves@frontiernet.net
http://www.frontiernet.net/~scaves/verbs.html