Re: CHAT: This or that that.

Lars Finsen skrev:
 > Den 11. feb. 2007 kl. 01.55 skrev T. A. McLeay:
 >>
 >> Outside of Britain (and Ireland?) most people have [æ].
 >> In parts of England they even used to have [æ], which is
 >> where the rest of us got it from, but now it's moved
 >> lower/central for a lot of English dialects (and for
 >> others was probably never fronted in the first place).
 >> I'm told the reason it was fronted was because the vowel
 >> of LOT was unrounded and low (much like the present day
 >> American value, but no doubt shorter), so TRAP moved
 >> forwards to help the contrast. As in all things, formal
 >> education is a bit behind the cutting edge.

Yes, as far back as in "Accents of English" in 1982
J.C.Wells mentioned that TRAP was [a] for many younger
speakers in the south of England and even for many RP
speakers, so it must have been around for a while. It is
kind of interesting as those same speakers have [6] for
STRUT. Will they merge or will strut raise? The distinct
long version of TRAP which these accents also have in some
words may conceivably 'break' to along an Ea > ea > ia path
much like happened in Frisian and eastern American English,
but the short TRAP would seem to have nowhere to go, so it
is STRUT which has to change if they are not to merge!

 > Thanks, that was interesting. I guess the [{] in
 > England always has been a minority phenomenon, maybe a
 > small one too.

No, but it is/was a regional phenomenon of southern England.

 >> You'll be understood perfectly well if you pronounce it
 >> as [a] wherever you go. If you want to learn an American
 >> accent, it's probably best to try for [æ].

Yes, especially as most Americans are likely to hear [kat]
as _cot_ rather than as _cat_. American /&/ is strongly
pharyngealized, while many Americans have a rather fronted
/A/ compared to British /A/ and /Q/. I think you, Lars,
would be better off using the vowel of Norwegian _fæl_
for English TRAP, *except* perhaps when you are in
northern England!

 > You know I have my school English, but I notice that when
 > I stay with some friends that I have on Humberside for a
 > few days, my school English is giving way somehow - to a
 > more real English I suppose.

I also tend to pick up whatever pronunciation those around
me use, and not only in English, which can be kind of
embarrassing at times, actually.
--


/BP 8^)>
--
Benct Philip Jonsson -- melroch at melroch dot se

    a shprakh iz a dialekt mit an armey un flot

                                 (Max Weinreich)

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