Re: Lukashenka (jara: Country names still needed)

On Thu, 15 May 2003 06:28:02 +0100, Jan van Steenbergen
<ijzeren_jan@...> wrote:

> --- Herman Miller skrzypszy:
>
>> In Lindiga, "Siostakoavits", "Prrakoafiev", and "Chatiatourrian".
>
>Why double "r"? How is single "r" pronounced?
Double r is pronounced [r], single r is a retroflex flap as in Hindi (APA
[r;], X-SAMPA [r`]).

And "Prrakoafiev" is a misprint for "Prrakoafiëv". (Oops! I forgot that
"ie" is [i:]!)

>> The problem is, I don't always know the correct original
>> pronunciation, so I end up with a distorted Lindigization of an English
>> version that's distorted to begin with, or I make certain assumptions that
>> might not be accurate (like assuming the name "Prokofiev" is stressed on
>> the second "o").
>
>Neither pronunciation nor accent matter here. Don't forget that a
>transliteration represents written Cyrillic, not spoken Russian. So, whether a
>Russian says ["mO5@t@f], [mA"5Ot@f], or [m@5a"tOf], the transliteration is
>always "Molotov".
On the other hand, I'd rather not use transliterations in Lindiga (except
as a first approximation of the pronunciation, if I don't know it).

I don't always have the Cyrillic versions to refer to, but sometimes it's
possible to guess. I searched Google and found 187 instances of
"&#1055;&#1088;&#1086;&#1082;&#1086;&#1092;&#1080;&#1077;&#1074;".

Of course, it's always possible to stumble upon a misspelling. I thought
this number was a little low, so I tried
"&#1055;&#1088;&#1086;&#1082;&#1086;&#1092;&#1100;&#1077;&#1074;" and got
about 26,000 references. That's better! Actually, a list of names in the
original non-English spelling could be a useful resource.....

>> And I'm not sure what to do with foreign sounds like [tS].
>
>Every language deals with that problem in its own way. English has "ch", French
>"tch", Dutch "tsj", German "tsch", Greek "ts", Hungarian "cs", Polish "cz",
>etc. Just wonder how a Lindigan would write [tS], or, if the sound is absent in
>his language, how he would approximate it.
>And remember that Russian has also [t_j] and [ts].
Well, I don't know if I'll always be able to represent every distinction in
every language. If I wanted to, I could use a retroflex "rts" [t;s;] /
[t`s`] for Russian "sh", to distinguish it from "ts", and a palatalized "t"
followed by a vowel could be "ti" [tSj]. But a palatalized "t" at the end
of a word or followed by a consonant would be a problem.

--
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