Re: CHAT: The Fabulous Personalities of Conlang

Mike S wrote:
>Andreas Johansson <and_yo@...> wrote:
>
> >I'm a INTJ (with preferences of 11% 33% 33% 33%) according to this test.
> >While the description of an INTJ seemed reasonably close to what I think
>I
> >know about myself, I must say many of the questions seemed slightly
> >ill-formulated; how difficult to excite/enrage is difficult? How easy to
> >communicate in social settings is easy?
> >
> >Also, I don't like the implication that I'm an intuitive thinker! I do
>wish
> >to believe my conclusions are generally legitimately deduced from
>objective
> >observations ...
>
>Well, actually INTJ's *do* make decisions that way.  They are
>secondarily extraverted thinkers.  It's where they get their
>information from that is introverted-intuitive (on balance).
>Which is to say, they generally rely a lot on finding patterns
>(intuiting) in remembered observations (introversion).  They use
>these patterns in their objective judgements (thinking) about
>the outside world (extraversion).  Which sorta explains why they
>often like science.
OK. They seem to be using the word "intuition" in a rather different sense
than what I thought.

                                                 Andreas
>
>Sorry if that's confusing.  What I wanted to point out is
>that Myers-Briggs notation obfuscates the underlying Jungian
>theory, unless you know how to decipher it.  Here is a
>super-brief sketch of what Jung had in mind:
>
>There are four _functions_: intuition (N) and sensation (S)
>are _perceiving_ functions;  thinking (T) and feeling (F) are
>_judging_ functions.  Perceiving means getting your data; judging
>means evaluating your data.
>
>In addition, there are two _attitudes_: extraversion (E) and
>introversion (I).  These terms are almost vernacular by now, but
>they originated with Jung.  They refer to where the attention
>and mental energy tend to get focused, externally or internally.
>
>Jung said that every person has all the functions and attitudes,
>but that one of each will be _dominant_.  Which is to say,
>more exercized than the others.  For example, a person could
>be basically an introverted thinker, an extraverted sensor,
>etc.  This gives us the eight basic Jungian psychological types.
>
>In addition to this, for every person, one function and attitude
>will be _auxiliary_, which is to say, it helps out the dominant
>function.  However, the auxiliary function can't be just anything;
>there are contraints.  If your dominant attitude is E, then your
>auxiliary must be I, and vice versa.  In addition, if your dominant
>function is perceiving (N or S), then your auxiliary must be
>judging (T or F), and vice versa.  Without this necessary balance,
>you'd be a basket case.
>
>The result is that each of the eight basic Jungian types can be
>subdivided into two subtypes.  Dominant introverted thinking can
>be coupled with auxiliary extraverted sensing, or extraverted
>intuition;  Dominant ES can be coupled with auxiliary IT or IF;
>and so on.  This is where the sixteen Myer-Briggs types come from.
>
>Now, the most straightforward method for encoding these types
>would have been using the six letters (S, N, F, T; I, E) and
>directly writing the dominant and auxiliary functions in order:
>Thus, we'd have ITEN's, ESIF's and so on.  A more sophisticated
>approach would be to drop the third letter, since we know that
>it will always be opposite the first letter.  Thus we'd have
>ITN (not to be confused with INT!), ESF, etc.  But neither
>of these methods was how they chose to do it.
>
>I said this would be super-brief, but I suppose I should explain
>the rest.  What happened was that Myers and/or Briggs observed
>that there were very marked differences in behavior depending
>on whether a person's strongest extraverted function was
>judging or perceiving, regardless of whether this function
>was actually dominant or auxiliary.  Because this distinction
>was relatively easy to measure, they decided it would be
>worthwhile to use it in their encoding.  Thus the MBTI system
>gives P for perceivers-those who *extravert* their perceiving
>function (and introvert their judging function), and J for
>judgers -those who *extravert* their judging function (and
>*introvert* their perceiving function).
>
>Nota bene: P and J do *not* mark the dominant function; they
>mark the function that gets extraverted.
>
>Here's a quick summary of how the MBTI letters work:
>
>First letter:  E or I = the dominant attitude = the attitude
>of dominant function (which can be any: N, S, F, or T).
>
>Second letter:  N or S = the stronger perceiving function.
>Can be *either* dominant or auxiliary; can be *either*
>introverted or extraverted.
>
>Third letter: F or T = the stronger judging function.
>Can be *either* dominant or auxiliary; can be *either*
>introverted or extraverted.
>
>Fourth letter: J or P = the strongest function that gets
>extraverted.  Can be *either* dominant or auxiliary;  can be
>any function.
>
>In case the above is clear as mud, here is a breakdown of
>the sixteen types by Jungian attitude-function combos.
>
>MBTI = dominant + auxiliary + tertiary + inferior
>
>ENFJ = EF + IN + ES + IT
>ENFP = EN + IF + ET + IS
>ENTJ = ET + IN + ES + IF
>ENTP = EN + IT + EF + IS
>ESFJ = EF + IS + EN + IT
>ESFP = ES + IF + ET + IN
>ESTJ = ET + IS + EN + IF
>ESTP = ES + IT + EF + IN
>INFJ = IN + EF + IT + ES
>INFP = IF + EN + IS + ET
>INTJ = IN + ET + IF + ES
>INTP = IT + EN + IS + EF
>ISFJ = IS + EF + IT + EN
>ISFP = IF + ES + IN + ET
>ISTJ = IS + ET + IF + EN
>ISTP = IT + ES + IN + EF
>
>I hope that someone finds this curious :-)
>
>
>Regards



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