Re: Translation challenge: Would you go out with me?

----- Original Message -----
From: "Sai Emrys" <sai@...>


> Well, obvious "would you go out with me" is meaningless (or severely
> gutted) without being in a social/cultural context of Relationships
> with a capital R.
>
> I'm not familiar with how Teonaht handles this, so I can't suggest
> specific approaches. Does it have anything inbetween the general
> relationship types of "marriage" and "friendly outing"? Or a concept
> of doing things together as a way very specifically intended to
> develop a Relationship? If not, then perhaps it's untranslatable. If
> it does, then something within that context?
Okay, here's what I've come up with while I should have been grading.  I'm
getting dizzy again. ;)  The Teonim are not a prudish people, but a people
surrounded by custom; indirection, chaperoned blind dates, invites of
eligible bachelors to eligible women's parties, etc.  Very Victorian.  But
unlike the Victorians, not terribly shocked by the vast amount of "illicit"
sex that goes on.  And certainly not ignorant!  Cunning women around the
corner to help the "virgins" (niffylim) in need.  Meanwhile, notes and
"billydoos" and formal language exist for "asking a woman for her sexual or
romantic attentions."  As with a lot of verbal exchanges, the T. go in for
frilly circumlocution and metaphor.  Here are some in order of degree (from
more formal to more casual).  I haven't gotten around to the invitations
given men by women yet, and all the women's responses are cautious.  And
sometimes a book is just a book. Context is all, and libraries are dangerous
places for the earnest man!

Lo:
Kyam rykken ellepma wemry hain. Ain fy dhar ha?
(I see a book I might read.  Do you have it?)
Ly:
Leynim fringkemp fetl yhha, send dorla le ellepmo es.
(I have a thousand pages, and it will be a long time reading.)
       i.e., she wants to move slowly.

Lo:
Fel fyrnea rykke, fen wemry hovary eton.
(I see a lovely meadow where I could plant a tree.)
Ly:
Fel fyrnea rykke, hadham'on hovary hovik.
(I see a lovely meadow where one can build a house.)
     i.e., she wants a long-term relationship.

Lo:
Kwe perva fy, aril pelnarn hovar ry.
(Where you will be, at the river I will be.)
Ly:
Ty tefye lindrary al kaptyo.
(Only if I bring my otter.)
    i.e., she may bring a chaperone

Lo:
Celil ydonar niffyrla lembats!
(Let us kindle branches in the forest!)
Ly:
Ma il etonin vera flehhtyzmats!
(But let's not burn down the trees.)
      she's receptive, but cautious.

Lo:
Il hsimra le paodra osply pomfo?
(Will the doe accompany the stag?)
Ly:
Kwar nwetis aid nopin?
(How many points does it have?)
Vuldrip.
(Fourteen.)
Ob nwetis.
(Too many.)
Leyn.
(Ten)
Makavent!
(Better!)

Lo:
Frona rykke pomfo wemhai ol euil ninnistro.
(I see a friend who could accompany me to the games.)
Ly:
Tibro frona sy hdar ke... ol e al nantry?
(Do you see two friends... me and my mother?)

Lo:
O euil ydonar pomfof, Hissytra!
(Come with me to the woods, Issytra!)
Ly:
Bikraf uinnyht fyl eton.
(Chop down your tree by yourself!)

Lo:
Fyl lembarem ryddihs.
(I'd like to give you an orgasm-- lit. "kindle you.")
Ly:
Ry tyr!
(Me too!)

}-)
Sally


> On 12/10/06, Sally Caves <scaves@...> wrote:
>> Again late to this thread, Sai.... what if your conculture doesn't
>> include
>> "dating" (as this phrase suggests in English)?  :-/  In Teonaht one can
>> invite people to their homes for dinner, to a restaurant, to a show, men
>> can
>> invite other men to accompany them to taverns, women can invite women to
>> go
>> to the fair, groups of women can invite groups of men to picnics, and so
>> forth.  It's very Sense and Sensibility, but there's no formal sense of
>> "dating" or "going out," or "stepping out," by a man and a woman.
>> Intrigues, yes, assignations, definitely! But normatively, there is only
>> the
>> sense of "invitation" and "accompaniment":  Saro syl pomfor aril commanco
>> wemai heljend.  "Your accompanying to the banquet (or whatever) would
>> happy-state for us."
>>
>> Sally
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Sai Emrys" <sai@...>
>> To: <CONLANG@...>
>> Sent: Saturday, November 25, 2006 6:08 PM
>> Subject: Translation challenge: Would you go out with me?
>>
>>
>> > In your own conlang(s) (and/or weirder natlangs) or any you know; with
>> > culturally appropriate equivalents.
>> >
>> > Extra bonus points if you post an audio recording.
>> >
>> > It'd be neat to use as an example for a conlang class or talk re
>> > worldviews and phonaesthetics.
>> >
>> > - Sai
>> >
>>
>

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