"Conlang" and "Artlang" in German (was ... in Swedish)
|From:||Jörg Rhiemeier <joerg_rhiemeier@...>|
|Date:||Tuesday, January 20, 2009, 20:14|
On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 13:56:23 +0100, Henrik Theiling wrote:
> Benct Philip Jonsson wites:
> > However this incorporation of the word for 'art'
> > into the general term for 'conlang' makes a problem
> > of how to translate 'artlang'! So far I've come up with
> > tree alternatives, all of which have their drawbacks,
> > and none of which is very short:
> In German, I avoid the problem by using the English terms -- they are
> specialised vocab.
Where is your language aesthetics? While I am not generally
hostile to borrowings, I think it is better to use a German
word than to use an unnecessary anglicism which many people
probably won't understand.
> 'Kunstsprache' is really fixed vocab in German. Esperanto is
> definitely a 'Kunstsprache', but surely not an artlang, which would be
> the literal translation.
While _Kunst_ as a standalone word means 'art', in compounds
such as _Kunststoff_ or _Kunstdünger_ it usually means
'artificial'. Indeed, the term _Kunstsprache_ is quite widely
used in the general meaning of 'artificial language', covering
all kinds of conlangs.
For 'international auxiliary language', we have _Welthilfssprache_;
also _Plansprache_ is often used for that, though some use it in
the general meaning of 'conlang'. However, I feel that _Plansprache_
sounds way too much like a product of engineering to do justice to a
naturalistic artlang such as Quenya. 'Artistic language' I would
translate as _künstlerische Sprache_ (somewhat cumbersome, though)
or _Kunst-Sprache_ (though uncomfortably close to _Kunstsprache_).
I don't know what kind of word to use for 'engelang', though.
> I think there was a discussion about this on
> the German conlang Yahoo group (which is dead now for at least a year
> or two), but I do not remember what the result was.
I dimly remember such a thread, too, but as far as I can
remember, the result was inconclusive.
> Using adjectives
> seems unelegant to me -- as a German I prefer compounds. :-)
Both have their pros and cons.
> Another word that has no good translation is 'conlanger'.
> 'Kunstsprachenerfinder' ('conlang inventor') is kind of bulky.
> 'Spracherfinder' ('language inventor') would be almost ok.
_Sprachenerfinder_ works perfectly well, and is what I use;
the second member makes the element _Kunst-_ redundant.
On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 15:11:09 +0100, Benct Philip Jonsson wrote:
> What about _Kunstsprachler_? Surely the verb 'to conlang'
> must be _kunstspracheln_ in German, and even if it isn't
> there is _Wissenschaftler_ in spite of there being no
> verb _*Wissenschafteln_.
_Kunstspracheln_??? BAAAH! What an ugly word! To me, it
sounds like 'to fiddle about with conlangs without ever
achieving a satisfactory result'.
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