Re: Allophone Problem
|From:||Andreas Johansson <andjo@...>|
|Date:||Monday, June 11, 2007, 11:21|
Quoting "T. A. McLeay" <conlang@...>:
> Henrik Theiling wrote:
> >> Well, that's exactly the thing, though. They ran experiments
> >> with people just like you who never doubted that the words
> >> were identical, and they consistently were able to spot which
> >> one ended in a voiced consonant and which one a voiceless
> >> (they tested the results statistically, and all that).
> > Interesting. It is a bit puzzling, though. How can the speech center
> > produce different phones when for the rest of the brain, they are
> > identical? I could imagine the reverse case, when the human is sure
> > there is a difference when there really is none in the audio data, but
> > the other way around contradicts my intuition.
> > I think I will have a read some papers then.
> I gather that in some dialects of Swedish, there are two kinds of /e/
> which never merged, but merged in the standard varieties, so the
> orthography doesnt distinguish them. Phonetically I think theyre
> fairly distinct (not like these near merges that miss), and the
> distinction is quite consistent, but native speakers consider them to be
> the same.
> Perhaps one of our Swedish listmembers can provide more detail on that,
> at least..?
I assume you're talking about /e/ and /E/, the short froms of which have merged
as [E] in the standard 'lects. They're more-or-less consistently kept apart in
writing as <e> vs. <ä>. Some dialects keep them distinct also in pronunciation,
but apparently some speakers of such dialects nonetheless claim to merge them.
You also get the opposite; people who claim to pronounce them differently yet
can't tell their own recored pronunciations of pairs like _sett_~_sätt_ apart.
* The long versions merge as [e:] in some 'lects, but this is considered
(I'm having trouble posting this. Sorry for any multiple posts.)