Theiling Online    Sitemap    Conlang Mailing List HQ   

Carthangyz / Re: Alborgian

From:Ingmar Roerdinkholder <ingmar.roerdinkholder@...>
Date:Tuesday, July 5, 2005, 21:15
Yeah, I know about that, remember last year we mailed about Slavo-
Turcologics, I sent you some information about my own variety "Carthangyz",
a Turkic language spoken by Orthodox Christians on the Black Sea island
Carthangyzia, related to Crimean Osman, Crimean Tartar and Gauguz.
I'm curious wether you used some of it for your Kuman Tyli.

The name Carthangyz is - of course - a Greek version of old Turkic *kara
<black> + *tängiz <sea>, cf modern Turkish <Kara Deniz> = Black Sea.

Carthangyz has two main dialects: the major, Northern one around the
capital, and the Southern one which is much closer to Turkish. Carthangyz
orthography is designed in a way that both pronunciations are possible.
E.g. ë = North [jE], South [e]; ö = N [jO], South [2]; ü = N [ju], S [y],
j = N [Z], S [j] etc. Northern Carthangyz phonology is influenced a lot by
Slavonic languages like Russian, Ukrainian, and Bulgarian, and gave up
vowel harmony altogether, unlike Southern pronunciaton. Vowel harmony is
still reflected in the orthography though.

Examples of Carthangyz:

     orth.  North     South    Turkish
1    bir   [bjir]     [bir]    bir     [bir]
2    ëki   ["jEki]    ["eki]   iki     [iki]
3    üc    [jutS]     [ytS]    üç      [ytS]
4    dört  [djOrt]    [d2rt]   dört    [d2rt]
5    bex   [bES]      [bES]    bes,    [bES]
6    altï  ["alti]    ["alt@]  altI    [alt@]
7    jedi  ["ZEdi]    ["jEdi]  yedi    [jEdi]
8    sekiz [sE"kis]   [sE"kiz] sekiz   [sEkiz]
9    dokïz [dO"kis]   [dO"k@z] dokuz   [dOkuz]
10   on    [On]       [On]     on      [On]
20   järmi ["zarmi]   ["jErmi] yirmi   [jirmi]
40   kÿrk  [k@rk]     [k@rk]   kIrk    [k@rk]
60   alpmïx[alp"miS]  [alp"m@S]altmIs, [altm@S]
80   seksän[sek"san]  [sEk"sEn]seksen  [sEksEn]
100  jüz   [Zus]      [jyz]    yüz     [jyz]
1000 bing  [bjiNk]    [biN]    bin     [bin]

to be new:  North        South          Turkish
jänyimin    ["Zanjimin]  ["jEnjimin]    yeniyim    I am new
jänyisin    ["Zanjisin]  ["jEnjisin]    yenisin    you (sing) are new
jänyidir    ["Zanjidir]  ["jEnjidir]    yenidir    he/she is new
jänyimiz    ["Zanjimis]  ["jEnjimiz]    yeniyiz    we are new
jänyisinyiz ["Zanjisi~s] ["jEnjisinjiz] yenisiniz  you (pl) are new
jänyidär    ["Zanjidar]  ["jEnjidEr]    yenidirler they are new

sen; senin/sën; sang'a; seni; sendä; sendän - you; gen; dat; acc; loc; abl
ol; anïn/ayn; ang'a; anï; anda; andan - he/she/it
biz; bizim/bin; bizyä; bizi; bizdä; bizdän - we
siz; sizin/sin; sizyä; sizi; sizdä; sizdän - you (pl)
olar; anlarïn/layn; anlara; anlarï; anlarda; anlardan - they

as you will have noticed: <ben> with <b-> like in Turkish, the other cases
with <m-> like all other Turkic languages

to be a doctor:      N        S             T
doqtorïm    [dOx"tOrim]  [dOx"tOr@m]    doktorum   I'm a doctor
doqtorsïn   [dOx"tOrsin] [dOx"tOrs@m]   doktorsun  you're a etc
doqtordïr   [dOx"tOrdir] [dOx"tOrd@r]   doktordur  he etc
doqtorïz    [dOx"tOris]  [dOx"tOr@z]    doktoruz   w
doqtordar   [dOx"tOrdar] [dOx"tOrdar]   doktordurlar

                 N            S             T
düxinmäk    [dju"Sinmak]  [dy"SinmEk]    düs,ünmek      to think
düxinäyrim  [dju"Sinajrim][dy"SinEjrim]  düs,ünüyorum   I think
düxinäysin  [dju"Sinajsin][dy"SinEjsin]  düs,ünüyorsun  you think
düxinäy     [dju"Sinaj]   [dy"SinEj]     düs,ünüyor     he/she thinks
düxinäyriz  [dju"Sinajris][dy"SinEjriz]  düs,ünüyoruz   we think
düxinäysiz  [dju"Sinajsis][dy"SinEjsiz]  düs,ünüyorsunuz you (pl) think
düxinäylär  [dju"Sinajlar][dy"SinEjlEr]  düs,ünüyorlar  they think


On Tue, 5 Jul 2005 21:16:32 +0300, Isaac Penzev <isaacp@...> wrote:

>Ingmar Roerdinkholder jazdy: > >> Did you name it after "Ajami", better known as Mozárabe (Mozarabic), the >> Romance language of Andalucia under Moorish rule? > >Mozarabic was the prototype I had in mind while constructing this
project. I
>invented the name "3ajamiya" before I knew it had been applied to the REAL >language. > >> I'd like to know more about YOUR Ajami, is it a conlang or is it a
>> form of Mozarabe, or ... Tell me all about it. > >Since the conhistory of the project lies in the realm of an alternative >timeline (where there were no Reconquista), it is definitely a conlang. >Resources about Mozarabaic *here are too scarce, so MY Ajami is a kind of >Mediaeval Spanish plus a lot of Arabic lexical borrowings. I used Farsi
as a
>pattern. > >Most of the material is on paper. I have uploaded today several sporadic
>pages that were originally intended to be my private notes in digital
>but I had no time to type all I had on paper. You can see it here: > > > >To see it correctly, you may need to switch to WestEuropean encoding >manually - blame it to the > >> Btw, I'm sure there is enough to be found on the web about all kind of >> Arabic dialects, just try and look for it. >> >> If your interested, I can send you my file about Alborgian, but it is >> written in Dutch... > >No, thanx. I think I could figure out linguistic Dutch, but Arabic
>aren't my first priority now. I'm trying to find time and stamina for >fleshing out my project #20 (a Turkic conlang with strong Slavic
>and a concultural project of alternative history "1934: Kirov Is With Us". > >-- Yitzik >=========================================================================


Isaac Penzev <isaacp@...>Carthangyz