Re: CHAT: various infotaining natlang tidbits

> Date:         Wed, 14 Jun 2000 06:30:44 -0700
> From: AcadonBot <acadon@...>
> > From: "Lars Henrik Mathiesen" <thorinn@...>
> > Sent: Wednesday, June 14, 2000 5:06 AM
> > > From: Kristian Jensen <kljensen@...>
> >
> > >      Pikanini namba wan bilong Queen <Prince (of Wales) Charles>
> > >      Gras bilong hed <hair>
> > >      Miks masta bilong Jesus Christ <helicopter>
> >
> > > Date:         Wed, 14 Jun 2000 13:36:23 +0200
> > > From: Kristian Jensen <kljensen@...>
> >
> > > There were a lot terms like that equally (if not more) hilarious
> > > -- a pity I don't remember them.
> >
> > Hilariously simpleminded natives. Right.
> >
> > Well, it may turn out that these phrases are genuine old Tok Pisin.
>
> Some are. Some seem "humorous" in English. But this is no longer English.
> [...]
> Reader's Digest often presents a kind of pablum, IMO.
> Full of stereotypes. Unfortunate because widely read.
And did I indicate that I believe anything else now? My point is that
Kristian's phrases remind me of RD's 'jokes' --- and even if they are
or have been correct TP, they appear on lists of quaint pidgin phrases
exactly because they serve to confirm those horrible stereotypes.

> > For instance:
> >    Prince Charles was born in November 1948, after the Cargo Cult days
> > (which ended with WWII, IIRC). (OK, that's marginal).
>
> no relevance to cargo cult.
But that's what people have been claiming: that this is TP as used by
Cargo Cult followers, or at least in that time frame.

> The word pikinini is standard for child, descendent -- also seed/fruit
> So Prince Charles really is "pininini bilong kwin." No more humorous
> than the religious terms cited.
Yes, Prince Charles is the child of the Queen. But is 'pikinini namba
wan bilong kwin' the only way to talk about him in TP? That was the
original claim.

> >    Why would TP borrow a word for grass before a word for hair?
>
> It's both.
That the TP word for hair comes from English grass is only mildly
interesting. Weirder things can be found in an English dictionary.

What makes this 'hilarious' to some people is the implied claim that
TP has no word for hair, and has to use the circumlocution gras bilong
hed every time hair is mentioned.

> They don't much use mixmasters in the villages.
I wouldn't think so either. But sorry that I didn't get around to
putting that in my list of suspicions.

Anyway, I'm happy that you agree that the mixmaster thing is spurious.
If Kristian had only quoted the first two, my dander wouldn't have
been got up to the point of complaining.

> Leo J. Moser
Oh it's you, Leo. I was wondering who that Acadon guy was.

Lars Mathiesen (U of Copenhagen CS Dep) <thorinn@...> (Humour NOT marked)