Re: Need Advice on Syntax & Case System

--- In conlang@y..., Garrett Jones <alkaline@A...> wrote:

> Similarities:
> your nominative, my agent: unmarked in both langs
> your predicative, my "focus": 'u' in both langs
> your objective, my "patient": 'i' in both langs
Striking resemblances indeed.  =P   In fact, |i| and |u| have been the
accusative and oblique prepositions of Obrenje for years before I
changed the case system.

I guess we ended up with |i| and |u| because a case marker has to be
(a) short and (b) distinct.  Our high vowels don't cause any
obstructions in the speech flow, and polarize pretty strongly against
other vowels.

They also allow the "coloring" of other vowels in old preserved
inflections, e.g. |jae| /ja:/ becomes |je| /jE/ in the objective
and |aw| /aw/ in the predicative.



> A
> specific sentence example i would like to see is a sentence with a verb, a
> nominative, and an objective but no predicative, but not using any pronouns.
> The sentence "the dog sees you" is close to this, but it has a pronoun (so
> prepositional case marking isn't there).
No sooner said than done:

Kel     warev  i    torav.
See:3e  dog:d  OBJ  man:d
"The dog sees the man."

You'll find more such samples listed in the syntax section:

     http://catharsis.netpeople.ch/langmaking/obrenje_syntax.htm



> > - Can you think of situations where this case system would fail or
> >   produce problems?
>
> How do you apply your system to the equivalent of english sentences that
> have object compliments? for example:
>
> I called (him) (stupid).
> We elected (her) (president).
I'm surprised that you should mention these -- they are classical
applications of the predicative case!

Je          renoze      u    quq.
PER:3s:OBJ  name:PST:1  PRE  stupid
Lit: "I stupid-name him."
I name him stupid.

Je          ingonoze     u    naj       cej.
PER:3s:OBJ  elect:PST:1  PRE  member:i  one:d
Lit: "We first-member-elected her."
We elected her first member.



> They found (war) (to be the only possibility).
This one seems to be slightly different a problem.  There are three
possibilities: a preposition, a participle or a subordinate clause.

Cigaw        i    kruc   muj  cene    vuxe.
Find:PST:3i  OBJ  war:i  as   only:d  way:i
"They found war as the only of ways."

Cigaw        i    kruc   mom     u    cene    vuxe.
Find:PST:3i  OBJ  war:i  be:PTC  PRE  only:d  way:i
"They found war being the only of ways."

Cigaw        i    tse  mo     kruc   u    cene    vuxe.
Find:PST:3i  OBJ  TSE  be:3e  war:i  PRE  only:d  way:i
"They found that war is the only of ways."



-- Christian Thalmann