Re: Circumfixes?

Hi!

Danny Wier <dawier@...> writes:
> up with a crude grammar.  Features will include:
...
> and verbal nouns.
Crude? :-) Why?  This is not the same, but quite similar to my first
language Fukhian.  Here is an annotated list:

  - prepositional case formation, [different: case+postposition]
  - suffixal possessive [same (genitive clitics)] and object
    pronouns [same (other case clitics)]
  - VSO word order [same]
  - (subject pronouns, used only for emphasis [same],
    precede the verb [different, nothing precedes the verb (IIRC)]),
  - dual number [same],
  - two types of plural (sound or "small", and broken or "great")
    [same but different: nullar, singular, dual, trial, plural],
  - adjectives following noun [same] except for demonstratives [same? dunno] and
    numbers [different: they follow being full nouns and requiring genitive
    case on the counted entity],
  - adjectives agreeing with antecedents in number, case and gender
    [different: no agreement, no gender, but attributive marker on adjective],
  - direct genitive formation (the-noun the-adjective = the adjective noun),
    [what is this?]
  - and verbal nouns [same]

Especially this:

> "at" + noun-nom = adessive "at, on"
> "at" + noun-acc = allative "onto"
> "at" + noun-gen = ablative "from"
> "in" + noun-nom = inessive "in"
> "in" + noun-acc = illative "into"
> "in" + noun-gen = ellative "out of"
is very similar to Fukhian.  Fukhian has special cases, however:
locative, illative and seperative.  And instead of prefixes, it uses
postpositions.  But it's exactly the same idea.  It then is

   ROOT + CASE + POSTPOSITION

There are many postpositions that can be used by this.  Without, the
meaning is adessive, allative, ablative, with others it is `in, out of'
`under, from under', etc.  Many of them.

Your case choice seems to be borrowed from Ancient Greek, right?  I
think it looks quite IEish because of this, since, IIRC ablative and
genitive cases have usually merged here (especially visible in the
mentioned Greek).  I don't know much about Semitic grammar, so my
impression might be because of limited scope. :-)

> Anybody else use circumfixes or circumpositions in their conlang, or a
> dual-morpheme case marking system?
I would not call it a dual-morpheme case marking system, but because
the postpositions attach to the words in Fukhian, they might be
analysed as a second case ending rather than a postposition.  In that
case: yes to your last question. :-) But no circumanything in Fukhian.

Unfortunately, the grammar description is in German (I was very young
when I did it, and didn't know it would make it into a world wide
publishing media):
   http://www.theiling.de/projects/fuch/text/fuch.ascii.html

Maybe I translate it one day, it's not too long and contains a lot of
garbage...  Until then: ask. :-)

**Henrik

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